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Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

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Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#141

Post by pnutjam »

danso wrote: post #19
komali2 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am very confused - last night I filed my taxes in an hour flat on freefillableforms or whatever that terribly named piece of software is. I thought this was a service provided by the IRS?

I think freefillableforms.com -- maintained by the Free File Alliance -- is an example of what the article complains about: > The Free File Alliance, a private industry group, says 70% of American taxpayers are eligible to file for free. Those taxpayers, who must make less than $66,000, have access to free tax software provided by the companies. But just 3% of eligible U.S. taxpayers actually use the free program eac…

I've been using DIY or freetax.com. They don't seem to upsell.

I've been happy, but this year I couldn't e-file my state return and Indiana claims my daughter's was figured wrong.

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#142

Post by SilasX »

rayiner wrote: post #127
SilasX wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the public really to blame for this? Is there an actual broad constituency that doesn't want this, or at least who trusts an interest group to represent them and who doesn't want this?

I don’t want this? We are very bad in America about hiding taxes, e.g. through unfunded mandates and mandatory cross subsidies. We don’t need to do anything more for people to have even less insight into what the government actually collects from their paycheck.

That seems more like an argument for a different interface than against the service entirely -- that would justify making it so that you still have to see and sign a form that shows how much you're paying against what earnings.

I think you're falsely equating (as do the Norquist types)

a) "the financial burden of the tax should be explicit" (which is fair) and

b) "the paperwork should be unnecessarily burdensome" (which is sadistic).

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#143

Post by malvosenior »

germinalphrase wrote: post #133
malvosenior wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Freedom doesn't mean the same thing as "convenient for me". In fact freedom can often be difficult. Each item listed has an opposition position, most notably freedom to own a gun. Germany also has some of the most draconian anti-free speech laws of all first world nations, so I really don't think they're a good example to use as a pillar of freedom.

The elimination of medical bankruptcy is a “convenience”?

Yes, obviously anytime you get something for free that's a convenience. Someone has to pay for that though and that person is not experiencing freedom.

I don't know much about the German healthcare system but it's quite possible that you also don't have as many choices for healthcare as in the US due to increased governmental regulation.

I'd also add that healthcare is one of the least free aspects of US culture especially post-ACA. We are now mandated to have insurance, even if we don't want it.

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#144

Post by renholder »

rayiner wrote: post #140
renholder wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Is this similar to PAYE or do you actually have to submit a tax return but it's pre-filled for you? As long as your PAYE is like Ireland's (ROI) PAYE, then the American's system is far-removed from it. Even though their tax revenue office gets the reports from businesses for how much they were paid and how much taxes they paid, the Americans still need to fill out a tax form - every year - to repeat the same inform…

> Even though their tax revenue office gets the reports from businesses for how much they were paid and how much taxes they paid, the Americans still need to fill out a tax form - every year - to repeat the same information (it's an added benefit for the prison system, in that mistakes on tax forms can equate to jail time). They get a form from their employer (which their tax office also has), that contains all of th…

>There are no criminal penalties for mistakes on your tax form.

Odd, I thought you faced the penalty of perjury[0]?

[0] - https://www.forbes.com/sites/robertwood/2017/02/15/fudging-y...

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#145

Post by paulgb »

TheHypnotist wrote: post #108
onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will say, vote with your dollars. If you don't like Intuit's lobbying, please don't feed the beast and use their services.

What are suitable alternatives? Aren't they the best in class, regardless of how shitty that class is?

I swore off TurboTax after finding out about the tax lobby stuff and filed with TaxAct this year. I can't say for sure that they don't lobby but if they do they don't do so as loudly as Intuit.

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#146

Post by mullen »

floren wrote: post #113
TheHypnotist wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are suitable alternatives? Aren't they the best in class, regardless of how shitty that class is?

I have worked with an independent tax preparer for the last few years. In January, I walk over to a nearby restaurant where we meet, I hand over tax documents, she makes sure it's all there and asks some brief questions. A week or two later, she sends the completed state & federal forms along with the appropriate authorizations which will allow her to file on my behalf. I pay $200 for this service and consider it far…

Your tax preparer probably uses Intuit's tax preparation software for professions. I think it is called ProConnect.

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#147

Post by crazygringo »

I'm confused because I can't tell what this actually refers to. It says:

> Congressional Democrats and Republicans are moving to permanently bar the IRS from creating a free electronic tax filing system.

But the IRS already has one. I used it yesterday to fill out and e-file my taxes. It's "Free File Fillable Forms" (freefilefillableforms.com) that is basically an online replica of the tax forms, some fields get automatically calculated, but you have to manually calculate the actual level of tax you owe, and it's submitted electronically.

And all income levels can use it, unlike the free tier of commerical tax prep programs which are limited to below a certain income level.

I use it out of principle -- it's harder to use, closer to filling out tax forms by hand (unlike the "wizard"-type interfaces of commercial tax prep software), but I don't want to support the commercial solutions exactly because of lobbying like this.

So I can't tell what this bill aims to do specifically. Is it trying to get rid of Free File Fillable Forms, or is it preventing the IRS from building something better?

EDIT: Free File Fillable Forms is apparently a private organization that the IRS website links to. In my years of using it, I'd always assumed it was provided by the government. Wikipedia clarifies:

"Another component of Free File is Free File Fillable Forms, which is available to all taxpayers, including taxpayers whose incomes are greater than $66,000. It is an alternative to Free File Software, although both are free. Free File Fillable Forms is operated by a private organization, the Free File Alliance and not the IRS. Though IRS links to it, they do not endorse it or any product... There are no income restrictions for using Free File Fillable Forms... It provides free electronic filing. Free File Fillable Forms is managed by the Free File Alliance." [1]

I'm still unclear, however, if there's pressure to get rid of this option that is free for everyone. I sure hope not.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_File#Free_File_Fillable_F...

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#148

Post by otikik »

fsloth wrote: post #25

Oh man, I've had government provided automatic filings for ages now (Finland). US is really odd how it emphasizes the benefit of the middleman over the benefit of the individual citizen (it seems). Or have I completely misunderstood what's going on here?

> the benefit of the middleman over the benefit of the individual citizen

I think you put it just right. Health and Education are the two areas this is bought up, but the taxes are a good example.

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#149

Post by toast0 »

maimeowmeow wrote: post #124
toast0 wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The republicans haven't bragged about it, but I'm guessing limiting SALT deductions to way below the standard deduction will drastically reduce the number of filers itemizing deductions. That leaves you with form 1040 which is roughly half a page front and back, not much bigger than a postcard. Certainly, if you have capital gains or other things, you'll need extra schedules, and maybe you need to send w-2s, so it's…

If you have a mortgage, and paid state youd easily be over 2x the standard deductions

Not as of tax year 2018. SALT deduction is capped at $10k, standard deduction for married filing joint is $24k. I don't think you can get $14k worth of deductible mortgage interest, but I guess maybe. If you're filing single with a mortgage, it seems more likely to end up with itemized, still.

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#150

Post by otikik »

linuxftw wrote: post #43
fsloth wrote: post #25

Oh man, I've had government provided automatic filings for ages now (Finland). US is really odd how it emphasizes the benefit of the middleman over the benefit of the individual citizen (it seems). Or have I completely misunderstood what's going on here?

(in the US) I would trust the government provided tax-return software to provide the smallest refund possible. It will also take $50 billion and 3-4 years to develop, and it will be down from April 1st to May 7th due to overload on the system. Your confirmation emails won't come through, and the database will be hacked and all records leaked within the first 18 months of operation.

Then vote a better government.
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