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Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

propublica.org

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Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#101

Post by germinalphrase »

dnadler wrote: post #88
ohlookabird wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Clearly, it can vary a lot what people consider free. And therefore, this statement isn't true in general. The US does indeed have a lot of things I would consider freedoms, yes. But in Germany, for instance, I feel it is a great freedom to not have to worry about most healthcare issues, regardless of their income. A freedom (in my perspective) I wouldn't have in the US. There are other issues that fall into that cat…

That's a commonly made point, but to be a little pedantic you are definitely twisting the definition of the word 'freedom'. Those are benefits to be sure, and they may certainly be better than the US's, but not really 'freedoms'.

Why aren’t they “freedoms”? Increased financial security due to eliminating the possibility of medical bankruptcy increases an individuals’ options/choices in life, does it not?

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#102

Post by kej »

linuxftw wrote: post #43
fsloth wrote: post #25

Oh man, I've had government provided automatic filings for ages now (Finland). US is really odd how it emphasizes the benefit of the middleman over the benefit of the individual citizen (it seems). Or have I completely misunderstood what's going on here?

(in the US) I would trust the government provided tax-return software to provide the smallest refund possible. It will also take $50 billion and 3-4 years to develop, and it will be down from April 1st to May 7th due to overload on the system. Your confirmation emails won't come through, and the database will be hacked and all records leaked within the first 18 months of operation.

We used to have a telefile option where you spent ten minutes on the phone punching in numbers off your W-2 forms and then you wrote down a confirmation number. It only worked if you had a really simple tax situation, but it was so easy. I assume it was killed by the same lobbyists.

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#103

Post by trophycase »

knubie wrote: post #59
fsloth wrote: post #25

Oh man, I've had government provided automatic filings for ages now (Finland). US is really odd how it emphasizes the benefit of the middleman over the benefit of the individual citizen (it seems). Or have I completely misunderstood what's going on here?

The question I have is whether a government provided automatic filing would actually be cheaper (or more effective) than say, Turbotax. I see a couple of ways in which it might not be as favorable: 1. It costs more than $100 per tax payer per year to implement (about the cost of Turbotax). However the flat $100 or so that most people pay to Turbotax can be seen as a kind of regressive tax. 2. It is less effective at…

Turbotax jacked their prices up quite a bit this year as well.

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#104

Post by hundt »

As the article makes clear, this is not a unilateral ban on competing with tax prep software companies, but rather a deal (pre-existing but now codified into law) in which the companies agree to provide free tax prep software to low-income taxpayers and in exchange the federal government agrees not to create a competing product.

To me this sounds like a great deal for taxpayers. In exchange for not spending tons of taxpayer money on a project which may or may not turn out well, makers of existing high-quality products agree to voluntarily give free access to it to the majority of taxpayers.

The bill additionally codifies funding for the VITA program which provides free in-person preparation services for low-income taxpayers.

I think this is about as good as the situation can get without actually simplifying our tax code.

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#105

Post by magduf »

SkyBelow wrote: post #50
fsloth wrote: post #25

Oh man, I've had government provided automatic filings for ages now (Finland). US is really odd how it emphasizes the benefit of the middleman over the benefit of the individual citizen (it seems). Or have I completely misunderstood what's going on here?

>US is really odd how it emphasizes the benefit of the middleman over the benefit of the individual citizen (it seems). I wonder what extent this is decided by how we vote. As long as voters pick the politician who prioritizes the middle man and gets their campaign contribution is selected over the politician who prioritizes the public but whose opponent gets the middleman's campaign contribution we will continue to…

As I always like to say, we are getting the government we deserve.

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#106

Post by onlyrealcuzzo »

ddlatham wrote: post #56

NPR's Planet Money just re-ran an episode[1] related to this. In 2005, California ran a pilot program where they sent simple, pre-filled tax forms[2] to a sample of the population. 98% of people liked them and would use them again. In 2006 it would have become standard for California, but failed in the legislature by a single vote. Opposition was from two factions: lobbying by Intuit, and Grover Norquist claiming tha…

I will say, vote with your dollars. If you don't like Intuit's lobbying, please don't feed the beast and use their services.

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#107

Post by malvosenior »

germinalphrase wrote: post #101
dnadler wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a commonly made point, but to be a little pedantic you are definitely twisting the definition of the word 'freedom'. Those are benefits to be sure, and they may certainly be better than the US's, but not really 'freedoms'.

Why aren’t they “freedoms”? Increased financial security due to eliminating the possibility of medical bankruptcy increases an individuals’ options/choices in life, does it not?

Freedom doesn't mean the same thing as "convenient for me". In fact freedom can often be difficult. Each item listed has an opposition position, most notably freedom to own a gun.

Germany also has some of the most draconian anti-free speech laws of all first world nations, so I really don't think they're a good example to use as a pillar of freedom.

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#108

Post by TheHypnotist »

onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #106
ddlatham wrote: post #56

NPR's Planet Money just re-ran an episode[1] related to this. In 2005, California ran a pilot program where they sent simple, pre-filled tax forms[2] to a sample of the population. 98% of people liked them and would use them again. In 2006 it would have become standard for California, but failed in the legislature by a single vote. Opposition was from two factions: lobbying by Intuit, and Grover Norquist claiming tha…

I will say, vote with your dollars. If you don't like Intuit's lobbying, please don't feed the beast and use their services.

What are suitable alternatives? Aren't they the best in class, regardless of how shitty that class is?

Re: Congress Is About to Ban the US Government from Offering Free Online Tax Filing

#109

Post by _bxg1 »

fsloth wrote: post #25

Oh man, I've had government provided automatic filings for ages now (Finland). US is really odd how it emphasizes the benefit of the middleman over the benefit of the individual citizen (it seems). Or have I completely misunderstood what's going on here?

It's because historically our society has treated businesses, their leaders, and the free market as churches, priests, and God, respectively. They've brought us much wealth and power, but putting restraints on them or getting in their way at all are cardinal sins in American politics. Politicians can take bribes and then package the resulting deregulation with euphemisms like "small government" and "supporting the free market". The most brilliant part is how they serve huge corporations, but then sell their actions as supporting all (read: small, too) businesses, even when they don't.
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