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Samsung warns profit to fall 60%

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41–50 of 118 posts

Re: Samsung warns profit to fall 60%

#41
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sony has always been an enigma to me. They release devices that appear midrange or yesteryear, and I get excited because I generally test devices in that range. Then I see the price and wonder how they're even in the business anymore.

I think Sony is still a powerful brand for old people?

They lost me with the music CD root kits... IT's nearly impossible to avoid stuff that uses sony components, but haven't bought anything labelled sony since.

Re: Samsung warns profit to fall 60%

#42
post #38
post #6

Comments here are out of their mind. Samsung's smartphone business hasn't been a profit center for quite some time. Majority of profit came from DRAM and NAND, and profit fall is directly attributable to recent price crash of both.

Even with the price crash the prices are still higher than 2016. I purchased memory in 2016 and the price now is still about 30% higher than 2016.

Yes! People, Samsung Electronics is a public company. Here are public info on operating profit in USD:

25B (2016), 47B (2017), 54B (2018). 2019 Q1 profit is similar to 2016 Q1 profit. Things are simply going back to 2016 before DRAM/NAND price craze.

Re: Samsung warns profit to fall 60%

#43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What caused a price crash of both DRAM and NAND??

All the major SSD NAND flash producers finally hit volume production of 3D TLC NAND at roughly the same time last year which sent prices falling precipitously. I'm not aware of a similar pattern in DRAM, which if anything has been suspiciously high for a while to the point that many assume price fixing was to blame as has happened in the past.

I think people attributed DRAM demand to cloud computing hyperscaling. Demand was higher than actual demand, because all of Amazon, Microsoft, Google purchased DRAM assuming their market share would increase. Predicted market share probably totaled well over 100%.

Re: Samsung warns profit to fall 60%

#44
post #5

Samsung's problems are just beginning. They're getting destroyed on every front, and basically all comes from China. On the phone front, they were used to selling phones at premium pricing only relying on their brand name. You don't have to look past Nokia or Blackberry to see how that will end. They're not really innovative, and while their devices are generally quality, they've pushed the price point too high. Xiao…

Is TSMC really China?

No, T in TSMC stands for Taiwan.

Re: Samsung warns profit to fall 60%

#45
post #15

Been using a Huawei 3i phone for more than a month now. I literally could not tell if this was Huawei or Samsung if I was given this phone without prior knowledge. Although, there are rumors that Huawei are working on their own OS. And it would be interesting to see whether they would also introduce an OS for their laptop series.

"own OS" mentioned there is just another linux distro

Re: Samsung warns profit to fall 60%

#46
post #38
post #6

Comments here are out of their mind. Samsung's smartphone business hasn't been a profit center for quite some time. Majority of profit came from DRAM and NAND, and profit fall is directly attributable to recent price crash of both.

Even with the price crash the prices are still higher than 2016. I purchased memory in 2016 and the price now is still about 30% higher than 2016.

May be that was early 2016 or mid 2016? The price hike started in somewhere near the the last quarter of 2016. The current price are already back to 2016 average, we expect the price to keep falling as we have yet to see any price floor. At the current rate, with nothing in sight to turn things around, we should see the early 2016 prices this year, and expect to see historic new low in DRAM $/GB within the next 12-14 months.

Re: Samsung warns profit to fall 60%

#47
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Samsung was competing more in the mid to affordable I assumed Samsung’s android phones were the top of the range. Who do you think is the high end android phone brand

They make high end phones, but their sales volume doesn't make up for the margins. In terms of manufactured phone volume, the Galaxy line makes up a tiny fraction of their total sales. I feel like the vast majority of the Android ecosystem foot gunned itself pushing its way out of reasonably priced device segments. There really are no modern equivalents to the Moto G or Nexus 5 or even early One Plus phones in the $1…

There is always a reasonably priced model. Right now it is xiaomi poco phones.

Re: Samsung warns profit to fall 60%

#48
post #6

Comments here are out of their mind. Samsung's smartphone business hasn't been a profit center for quite some time. Majority of profit came from DRAM and NAND, and profit fall is directly attributable to recent price crash of both.

> price crash of both.

Example: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07N124XDS a few months ago 32GB SODIMM was near unobtanium, a less known brand on eBay alone sold 'em for like 350-375 and now the Samsung ones are on Amazon at below 230 USD. Still has a 25-30% premium over smaller sticks but that's expected.

Re: Samsung warns profit to fall 60%

#49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What caused a price crash of both DRAM and NAND??

There is more background in other articles on Samsung's prediction: >Samsung said it received fewer orders from cloud service providers, such as Amazon, as well as from handset makers, such as Apple, which has recently seen a slowdown of its own smartphone sales. This low demand in the cloud services and smartphone markets for both DRAM and NAND flash chips have pushed the prices of these chips down. >According to Bl…

I have never trusted this Datacentre narratives because it doesn't make sense. On one hand you have you Intel saying they can not supply enough CPU because of high demands, on the other hand Component manufacture are blaming the low Supply in the channel for their lower than expected sales. All while AMD is taking server and desktop side market shares, no matter how small the percentage that is.

I think it basically boils down to few things.

1. Surprise Drop of Smartphone Unit Sold, we saw the first YoY decline in total Smartphone Unit shipment. ( Unit, not revenue ). Out of a 1.3B Smartphone market, even a 5% drop is a huge volume to fill.

2. Better than expected yield of 3D NAND. Which means you actually have an increase in output. And it just happen all three, Samsung, SK Hynix and Micron were able to yield better at the same time. To be fair they have been very conservatives with their estimate.

3. More Chinese DRAM and NAND are being used in the Domestic market. Which is unofficially required for selling phones in China.

All these along with the improved efficiency of DRAM and NAND Fabs for trying to fill orders during 2017 and 2018 without building new Fabs. Meant the DRAM / NAND are hit with a perfect storm.

Re: Samsung warns profit to fall 60%

#50
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Samsung was competing more in the mid to affordable I assumed Samsung’s android phones were the top of the range. Who do you think is the high end android phone brand

They make high end phones, but their sales volume doesn't make up for the margins. In terms of manufactured phone volume, the Galaxy line makes up a tiny fraction of their total sales. I feel like the vast majority of the Android ecosystem foot gunned itself pushing its way out of reasonably priced device segments. There really are no modern equivalents to the Moto G or Nexus 5 or even early One Plus phones in the $1…

Nokia does what you want. See eg https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2019/02/guidemaster-the-best...
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