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Why Don't Americans Understand How Poor Their Lives Are?

danielsjourney.com

221–230 of 332 posts

Re: Why Don't Americans Understand How Poor Their Lives Are?

#221
> Were we thinking of ourselves most of the time? Or were we thinking of what we could do for others, of what we could pack into the stream of life?

That final question he's quoting is from the alcoholics anonymous literature. I wonder if he knows that?

Another good one:

> Selfishness - self-centeredness! That, we think, is the root of our troubles. Driven by a hundred forms of fear, self-delusion, self-seeking, and self-pity, we step on the toes of our fellows...

Re: Why Don't Americans Understand How Poor Their Lives Are?

#222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's more because European capital is more risk averse and the labor laws here are very strong when compared to the US. That increases the risks involved in new ventures. The other thing is that Europe may have 500 million people, most of them speak a different language/culture. The US is one massive market who broadly share the same mother tongue. In the US you can have one company market to all states (and the 51st…

> The other thing is that Europe may have 500 million people, most of them speak a different language/culture That's far from sufficient to have a strong economy. Actually the strongest economies in the world (take GNI for example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GNI_(nomi... ) right now have small populations: Switzerland, Norway, Macau, Luxembourg, Iceland, Singapore... and the US. Most other dev…

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Re: Why Don't Americans Understand How Poor Their Lives Are?

#223
post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Americans don't believe the onus is on the whole to make sure the individual lives a happy life. We just don't have the collectivist culture the Europeans have. I think this is a great thing, and is why America is where most of the innovation, cultural, and political power is. I personally have lower taxes, high quality healthcare, and live in an awesome location, and I got all of that through an education and traini…

> I personally have lower taxes, high quality healthcare, and live in an awesome location, and I got all of that through an education and training. That is available to almost every American if they just put in the work. I'm sure that's nice for you personally. From what I've observed, this simply isn't true for many in America, who face desperate struggles despite hard work.

It simply isn't true for many anywhere; there are desperate, unhappy people everywhere.

Trying to argue whose is better (or worse) isn't helpful.

Re: Why Don't Americans Understand How Poor Their Lives Are?

#224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> One reason that Europe has very few innovative new companies created in the last 25 years is that everyone is at the coffee shop writing poetry. This does not dispute the central point of the quoted piece, which is that the quality of life of most Americans is very poor contrast to that of the average person in some subset of European countries. I would wager that most coffee shop employees are more concerned with…

Americans don't believe the onus is on the whole to make sure the individual lives a happy life. We just don't have the collectivist culture the Europeans have. I think this is a great thing, and is why America is where most of the innovation, cultural, and political power is. I personally have lower taxes, high quality healthcare, and live in an awesome location, and I got all of that through an education and traini…

It's sure nice to think so, and I thank you for stating this viewpoint so clearly. I think a lot about the line between rich and poor, launch and crash. I've come to think that line is largely in our own heads but also entirely out of our control.

Someone born poor will be born into an other reality of poverty. Every person they love will have no money, education or resume and will have crashed against unmoving walls while trying. Every mentor will teach them that the world takes and never gives. Every day will be tinged with hopelessness. Everyone will tell them they don't have what they ought to have and that there's no way someone like them can get it. This person could be as smart and filled with potential as the best of us and they will never escape this invisible cage of other people expectations.

Someone born rich with be born into an other reality of abundance. Every person they love will have a comfortable amount of money, educational achievement, and professional accomplishment and will have leapt over the obstacles in their life. Every mentor will teach them that if they ask, the world will give. Every day will glow with possibilities. Everyone will tell them about their success and make plans together for how to get even more. This person could be dumb as rocks and lazy but they too live in an invisible bubble of other people's expectations. The wisest of the people in this bubble of prosperity know exactly how fragile it is and work tirelessly to shape their families and communities so that their bubble never pops.

Re: Why Don't Americans Understand How Poor Their Lives Are?

#225
I worked a few years in Paris and then in Canada... often for American companies. Even if he exaggerates a bit the points many of my colleagues who did similar stints is that "In Europe you work to live. In North America you live to work."

And don't get me started about food... many Americans think whipped cream is that sweetened white colored oil in a can.

Re: Why Don't Americans Understand How Poor Their Lives Are?

#226
post #97
post #20

> In London, Paris, Berlin, I hop on the train, head to the cafe — it’s the afternoon, and nobody’s gotten to work until 9am, and even then, maybe not until 10 — order a carefully made coffee and a newly baked croissant, do some writing, pick up some fresh groceries, maybe a meal or two, head home — now it’s 6 or 7, and everyone else has already gone home around 5 — and watch something interesting, maybe a documentar…

I agree with the white-collar BS story. People work hard in Europe, and especially in cities, some need to work multiple jobs to afford a very basic life. But there's one part I disagree with: > One thing I love about America is that people still get shit done here. One reason that Europe has very few innovative new companies created in the last 25 years is that everyone is at the coffee shop writing poetry. I mean,…

I would argue against the author’s entire premise. The nature of (white collar) work is changing, even in America.

I work a job that is 80% remote. I work from a coffee shop in the morning (and in fact, I am there right now!) I block my calendar and go work out whenever I feel like it. I rented a mountain cabin for a month and went skiing every day while working in the mornings and evenings. I get my work done and show up when needed for meetings — so my coworkers / supervisors don’t need to know any of this.

Remote work is definitely the future for most industries. Collaboration tools are only improving, are cheaper than office space, and allows access to a global resource pool.

Re: Why Don't Americans Understand How Poor Their Lives Are?

#227
post #28

Americans don’t travel. If we did, we wouldn’t buy the myth of American exceptionalism. But then, we are largely becoming a country controlled by global financial interests rather than the population. Money is the deciding factor in our elections, and the most concentrated forms of wealth out there are sovereign wealth funds and large multinational corporations whose executives are largely above the law. Which means…

I hate traveling. I lift weights and going to Europe was the most physically draining experience. Going to a restaurant paying 12 Euros and getting 700 calories of carbs was awful. And having to pay for water... I felt physically terrible. By the end of the trip, I'd order 6 tuna or egg sandwiches. I don't travel because I find learning more interesting than looking at buildings.

> Going to a restaurant paying 12 Euros and getting 700 calories of carbs was awful

That's a strange and out of context example. I live in one of the more expensive European cities and for 12E still get to eat a pound of meat in a restaurant. Of course it will always depend on what you order and which restaurant. But your comparison is like saying the average rent in the US is $3000/mo (which it actually is, is some parts).

Re: Why Don't Americans Understand How Poor Their Lives Are?

#228
It all comes from the individualism and egocentrism and bullying of US culture. "It is made up of littler myths about greed being good, the weak deserving nothing, society being an arena, not a lever, for the survival of the fittest". You've been raised and thought to only think and work for yourself and consider your interests first...Until someone gets cancer and you have to launch a GoFundMe campaign and hope it'll not ruin your entire family. We sure have a lot of issues in Europe and by no mean are perfect societies or have the greatest companies. But at least we help each other, we support the less fortunate, we protect the weakest. And that's how you improve quality of life, life expectancy, a build a better society overall. I'm happy to give a significant part of my income to the government if it helps people survive and live better. And what you don't actually realize is that people are doing the same for you, because you might one day need it. Now why don't we have as many unicorns as you do in the U.S.? Because we're a bit more precautious and risk-averse, it's true.We don't go as fast and as strong as you. We first think 'Is this possible? safe? legal? right?' and then go on making the thing. While you just go, build it and ask questions later... which is an amazing fearless mindset which allowed you to accomplish incredible thing but which also leads to Facebook fucking up all over the world, Amazon treating their employees like slaves, or Boeing killing 350+ people because a 2nd safety system is too expensive.

Re: Why Don't Americans Understand How Poor Their Lives Are?

#229
post #110
post #19

This is the blathering of spoiled rich kid on vacation. > In London, Paris, Berlin, I hop on the train, head to the cafe — it’s the afternoon, and nobody’s gotten to work until 9am, and even then, maybe not until 10 — order a carefully made coffee and a newly baked croissant, do some writing, pick up some fresh groceries, maybe a meal or two, head home — now it’s 6 or 7, and everyone else has already gone home around…

I'd have to agree. > pick up some mass-produced groceries, full of toxins and colourings and GMOs, even if they are labelled “organic” and “fresh”, all forbidden in Europe As if just being a "GMO" by itself is a disqualifier. That'd be 90% of the crops on the planet. And the catch-all "toxins". Oi the naivety. There are some truths in that article but it was hard to read without cringing. That and he generalizes the…

Food colouring and additives are generally more restricted in the EU than the US though. For example: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/28/well/eat/food-additives-b...

Re: Why Don't Americans Understand How Poor Their Lives Are?

#230
post #20

> In London, Paris, Berlin, I hop on the train, head to the cafe — it’s the afternoon, and nobody’s gotten to work until 9am, and even then, maybe not until 10 — order a carefully made coffee and a newly baked croissant, do some writing, pick up some fresh groceries, maybe a meal or two, head home — now it’s 6 or 7, and everyone else has already gone home around 5 — and watch something interesting, maybe a documentar…

> See the people working at the coffee shop, the construction workers, garbage men, etc.

Yes - but - folks from those professions are still going to enjoy a much nicer life in Europe than in the States. I'm referring to NHS, job security, unemployment insurance, retirement and availability of pass time activities even in remoter areas.

> One thing I love about America is that people still get shit done here.

I mean is that a pun or just a Freudian slip - b/c with regard to 90% of SV's output this choice of words is fitting well.

Also a modern interpretation of civilized society is embracing a life not centered around productivity.

> One reason that Europe has very few innovative new companies created in the last 25 years is that everyone is at the coffee shop writing poetry.

That statement is wrong on both ends. European companies - especially those coming from central and northern Europe - are also just not as loud and attention craving as the usual fund driven start ups from the States. Also few people are writing poetry here.

> An old joke - "Every MBA in America dreams of starting a billion dollar business. Every MBA in Europe dreams of starting a satellite office of the American business."

MBAs aren't the only ones founding companies - also scientists and engineers do so.

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