A big problem about the basic income is that it is perceived as money that you get for nothing and so people don't have to work and therefore they are lazy. Let me give you an analogy: Imagine that breathing air would cost money and you would have to work in order to breathe. Unless you don't work you would die. Would then a basic income be something that makes you lazy or would it be something that gives you confide…
You’re basically saying that because it has ethical value it can’t make people lazy. That’s irrelevant. UBI might make people lazy. In fact, it would be pretty shocking if it didn’t make some % of the population choose to do nothing for their entire lives but stay at home and play video games. People like to point out that techies would feel more comfortable building start ups, and that’s probably true. But for peopl…
Finland’s Basic Income Experiment Shows Recipients Are Happier and More Secure
141–150 of 205 posts
Re: Finland’s Basic Income Experiment Shows Recipients Are Happier and More Secure
#142This article just looks like a copy paste job of Kela's official press release https://www.kela.fi/web/en/news-archive/-/asset_publisher/lN... Overall, the experiment failed to prove its main hypothesis that UBI would incentivize the unemployed to find employment. Those who received additional benefits failed to achieve higher employment than the control group. http://julkaisut.valtioneuvosto.fi/bitstream/handle/1002…
Re: Finland’s Basic Income Experiment Shows Recipients Are Happier and More Secure
#143Earlier quoted context omitted.
Would society be better off if Linux kernel developers stuck to doing things that paid?
How many people work full time ubpaid on the Linux kernel? For the 4.15 kernel, AMD, Intel, Google and Red Hat contributed between 35 and 50% of the changes, depending on whether you count number of commits or number of lines changed.
Only half rhetorical, as I'm actually curious.
Re: Finland’s Basic Income Experiment Shows Recipients Are Happier and More Secure
#144As a member of the Nordic societies I find it important to point out some important information. In these countries we already have rather sizable unemployment benefits. If you read the (better) article by NYT[0] on the same subject, you will be given an example showing her income under basic income only increased with 50$ out of 635$. [0]: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/09/world/europe/finland-basi...
Re: Finland’s Basic Income Experiment Shows Recipients Are Happier and More Secure
#145If you give people everything, they just won't work as hard. At least, I don't think they will over the long term. It's like retirement: some may learn a skill, volunteer, etc., but most just watch TV and wait to die. This is hard for many of us to realize, because we spend much of our free time tinkering with and leaning technologies. I hear a lot of people saying that society is bound to provide all the needs of a…
Easy solution: don't give them everything.
There's a lot of difference between "give people everything" and "make sure everyone has enough money for food and shelter". We're already doing the latter part, at least in the more civilized parts of the world. The argument for the U in UBI is that there's currently a whole lot of administration fees spent on determining who should get which handouts. If it's universal, all that management overhead disappears.
It's like retirement
Your view of retirement doesn't match the retired people around me.
Re: Finland’s Basic Income Experiment Shows Recipients Are Happier and More Secure
#146Earlier quoted context omitted.
There's absolutely no basis for a judgement like that without introducing assumptions about what's valuable and what's not.
Let's go with "valuable is something that improves your life" or "improves your wellbeing"
Re: Finland’s Basic Income Experiment Shows Recipients Are Happier and More Secure
#147Earlier quoted context omitted.
Well, this test is invalid for one more reason - recipients knew that the experiment has "end date." This means that the employment rates would not be affected since people could not treat the benefits as a permanent thing and plan accordingly. If you would take 1,000 people and give the lifetime benefits, I would assume this would change things a bit.
That's one of my points I always make when people mention UBI experiments. The other one is the amount is too low. I have never been to Finland, but can someone there comment on this: can you live on 560 euros a month without some other income or assistance?
Low income households receive a housing allowance as well.
https://www.kela.fi/web/en/housing-benefits-amount-and-payme...
Re: Finland’s Basic Income Experiment Shows Recipients Are Happier and More Secure
#148Earlier quoted context omitted.
You can't have a UBI without massive taxation. Massive taxation increases the risk of doing business. The higher the risks, the less entrepreneurship a country will see.
> Massive taxation increases the risk of doing business I encourage you to make a list of countries ordered by taxation level, and another one ordered by the risk of doing business. And then compare the two.
Re: Finland’s Basic Income Experiment Shows Recipients Are Happier and More Secure
#149Re: Finland’s Basic Income Experiment Shows Recipients Are Happier and More Secure
#150Is it a legitimate argument that smart hardworking people who are considered economically valuable will be swayed to non-economically valuable interests within this system? As a former fine arts student that became a UI developer mostly for the monetary stability, I do feel like if I had the ability to fully invest myself creating art without constantly struggling with relevancy and rent, I would have been far more q…
I work for an evil corporation which is harvesting data off gullible people who have no idea how their data is being used. If there was UBI, I'd have stopped working for them altogether.