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Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

theregister.co.uk

101–110 of 378 posts

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#101

The message it sends to me is, never visit America. I appreciate horrible things likely happen in my own country, but this is just disgusting.

America is awesome, I appreciate and know how lucky we are to be here.

I appreciate the fact I'm British, but not out of any patriotism. I certainly don't think my country is awesome. Considering life is a lottery, all things considered I've been incredibly lucky to be born in a 'developed' wealthy nation.

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#102
Traveling internationally with encrypted data you don't want to disclose to border officials is not a good plan these days. Much safer to transfer securely via network connection.

It's easy to single out the US but the reality is that most countries have pretty far reaching rules these days. E.g. the UK and Australia are hardly any safer. And forget about China, Russia, or indeed most countries with even less democratic regimes.

The bottom line is that if you are not willing to unlock your device at any of the security checkpoints you will pass on your journey, you should leave it at home or just wipe it preemptively and restore over a secure connection after you arrive. In case it does get unlocked or taken from you, consider the device burned. It may come back to you with all sorts of malware. The people doing this are not thinking you are a terrorist or a child pornographer: you are being targeted and under attack by a hostile entity. Assuming otherwise would be a mistake. Wipe it, sell it on e-bay, never use it again.

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#103
If another country were plan well, they could create opportunities that would attract and welcome the smart people from the US and elsewhere. If they made it economically attractive to tech businesses, they could set themselves up as a dominant leader of the world within 20-30 years, regardless of their current size.

I don't know enough about Estonia to suggest they would try this, but they do seem progressive in this regard. I would vote for Netherlands, Belgium, or Portugal just because I like being in those countries.

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#104
post #39

It was my understanding that 5-th amendment protections against unreasonable searches are suspended at the border. That would certainly include customs at the airport. So, in a strict legal sense, demanding to unlock a device does not violate the 5th.

the ACLU complaint is based on the 4th amendment right against unreasonable search. He demanded to speak to his lawyer and was thereafter allowed to leave, so his 5th amendment rights were not actually abridged. That's how the 5th amendment works, and it worked at the border. https://www.aclunc.org/docs/ACLU-NC_2019-03-28_Letter_re._El... > CBP must ensure that its officers comply with the U.S. Constitution. Even at…

Right, he meant to say that 4th amendment protections are suspended at the border, and, while you might quibble with that wording, it's a valid point: border searches usually don't require a warrant, owing to the border search exception, which has precedent going all the way back to the founders.

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#105
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems like a good idea, but it may land you in even more trouble. If it can be shown that you intentionally misled officers about content on your device, not merely denied questioning, you risk an obstruction of justice charge.

How about enforcing this by contract to shift the responsibility towards the employer, which presumably has more teeth to defend itself from abuses? Say a clause in every IT worker contract stating that when a LEO asks to unlock any device, a predefined user account must be used to log in. In the OP case, I'd hardly believe they'd send SWAT teams to Cupertino to raid Apple offices.

Yay for getting protection from your local Lord or Knight against the King. Sad if it’s come to this.

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#106
post #75

"...he clammed up, taking the Fifth, and citing constitutional rights against unwarranted searches. ...border agents told him he had no constitutional nor any legal protections, and threatened him with criminal charges should he not concede to the search. ...he was eventually allowed to leave with his belongings, the devices still locked, and no charges were pressed." My goodness! I guess those protections did exit a…

> Make sure your devices are turned off prior to even leaving for the airport. Security may ask you to turn them back on, not to search them, but to verify that they are actual working devices, and not a bomb.

Turning them on doesn't reduce the security. The issue is unlocking them.

As far as the security of the data on the device is concerned, a powered-off device is equivalent to a powered-on device that hasn't been unlocked since it was powered on.

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#107
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quick reminder: Non US citizens only go to conferences outside the US. There is no excuse we should put up with this. Canada and EU are much better locations for this reason alone.

Or New Zealand: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2018/10/0...

Given their reported membership in the Five Eyes, I don't see NZ as a place to be. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_Eyes

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#108
So really,

"Apple employee gets mildly harassed at airport because of proprietary confidentially agreements" with

"A terrible, terrible tragedy, non US-citizen travellers agree" as a byline.

The main thing of interest here would be that maybe Mozilla should employ better hiring practices.

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quick reminder: Non US citizens only go to conferences outside the US. There is no excuse we should put up with this. Canada and EU are much better locations for this reason alone.

Not much better in Canada: https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/guilty-plea-ends-case-t...

Yup! Not sure why Canada gets to slip under the radar on things like this. They are demanding access to devices as well.

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#110
post #14

Quick reminder: US citizens have an absolute right to reenter the country. Customs can temporarily detain you, but they cannot refuse entry. Any threat, whether implied or stated, that they will hold you until you unlock your device is not real. They can hold your stuff indefinitely, so be prepared to lose it if you go this route, but never unlock your device based on the idea that it’s the only way to go free. Non-c…

> They can hold your stuff indefinitely, so be prepared to lose it if you go this route CBP do need reasonable suspicion to hold you belongings or do a forensic search of your computer (Cotterman 2013) - they can't just randomly take things on a whim. The longer they hold it, the higher standard required.

Laws and precedent are one thing, but "law enforcement" behavior is another. You might indeed get your stuff back, but they can make it unreasonably difficult, expensive (in legal fees), or time consuming if they want.
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