No one should have to travel in fear • Hacker News Board

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#41

Post by rajbot » Tue, Apr 02, 2019, 9:04 PM UTC

JustSomeNobody wrote: post #39

rajbot wrote: post #35

> The agents proceeded to search my belongings and demanded that I unlock my smartphone and laptop. This was rather concerning for me. My phone and laptop are property of my employer and contain unreleased software and proprietary information. I’ve signed a non-disclosure agreement promising not to give anyone access. His employer is Apple. I was always worried about this same scenario when traveling with an Apple-ow…

Maybe keep the card of Apple's lawyers on your person. If you're in a situation like this, have them call the number. Or clarify Apple's policy on this before traveling.

His request to call his employer or an attorney was denied:

> I asked the agents if I could speak to my employer or an attorney before unlocking my devices. This request seemed to aggravate the customs officers. They informed me that I had no right to speak to an attorney at the border despite being a U.S. citizen, and threatened me that failure to immediately comply with their demand is a violation of federal criminal code 18 USC 111.

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#42

Post by zachberger » Tue, Apr 02, 2019, 9:04 PM UTC

komali2 wrote: post #23

Dunno what to do about this. I think TSA is a sham and a waste of my money. I think border control is taking my money and using it to abuse people. I don't think it's ok that I can pay to avoid the poor people line at the airport. I've written my reps and the president, I call about once a month, but it has no measurable effect. Smarter people than me have done audits on TSA and published them in famous newspapers to…

You don't have to pay to bypass the lines. The free "Mobile Passport" app allows you to go into a line is almost as quick as Global Entry.

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#43

Post by timdev2 » Tue, Apr 02, 2019, 9:05 PM UTC

komali2 wrote: post #23

Dunno what to do about this. I think TSA is a sham and a waste of my money. I think border control is taking my money and using it to abuse people. I don't think it's ok that I can pay to avoid the poor people line at the airport. I've written my reps and the president, I call about once a month, but it has no measurable effect. Smarter people than me have done audits on TSA and published them in famous newspapers to…

I don't disagree substantively with your sentiments, but you're conflating TSA and CBP.

TSA is ostensibly about security on airplanes (or more realistically "security theatre"), and are not law enforcement. You primarily deal with them before getting on an airplane in the US, for nearly all commercial flights (both international and domestic).

CBP are law enforcement officers in the customs (contraband, taxes, etc) and immigration (passport control, visas) domains operating at the border. If you're traveling by plane, you primarily deal with them after you disembark from an international flight.

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#44

Post by techslave » Tue, Apr 02, 2019, 9:05 PM UTC

rajbot wrote: post #35

> The agents proceeded to search my belongings and demanded that I unlock my smartphone and laptop. This was rather concerning for me. My phone and laptop are property of my employer and contain unreleased software and proprietary information. I’ve signed a non-disclosure agreement promising not to give anyone access. His employer is Apple. I was always worried about this same scenario when traveling with an Apple-ow…

if his employer is apple then he is fine to unlock. all such employers require you to follow border agent instructions. that said he may be in violation of a policy not to travel with proprietary info

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#45

Post by Diederich » Tue, Apr 02, 2019, 9:05 PM UTC

mchristen wrote: post #36

geofft wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a Global Entry holder myself I expect that because the government has done a background check on me, has my fingerprints, etc., it generally understands that (despite my Indian skin, unshaved stubble, and vote for Hillary) I am not a threat. I have voluntarily subjected myself the government conducting a background check and holding files / information on me in exchange for less hassle. So part of it is that it's…

I'm an American and I have been detained and searched by CBP without actually ever leaving the country. They didn't ask my name, just that we needed to get out of the car while they let their dog search the car.

Can you say where that happened?

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#46

Post by closetohome » Tue, Apr 02, 2019, 9:06 PM UTC

DanFeldman wrote: post #31

komali2 wrote: post #23

Dunno what to do about this. I think TSA is a sham and a waste of my money. I think border control is taking my money and using it to abuse people. I don't think it's ok that I can pay to avoid the poor people line at the airport. I've written my reps and the president, I call about once a month, but it has no measurable effect. Smarter people than me have done audits on TSA and published them in famous newspapers to…

For what its worth, SFO does not use the TSA [0]. The posted article does not mention the TSA at all, only Border Patrol and Customs agents. I've had terrible TSA experiences at other airports, but never a problem with the security at SFO. [0] https://www.miamiherald.com/news/nation-world/national/artic...

CBP is a waste of oxygen too. They're so incompetent the TSA could do their job and we wouldn't notice the difference.

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#47

Post by losteric » Tue, Apr 02, 2019, 9:06 PM UTC

komali2 wrote: post #23

Dunno what to do about this. I think TSA is a sham and a waste of my money. I think border control is taking my money and using it to abuse people. I don't think it's ok that I can pay to avoid the poor people line at the airport. I've written my reps and the president, I call about once a month, but it has no measurable effect. Smarter people than me have done audits on TSA and published them in famous newspapers to…

It seems more likely a public perception problem - not enough people know the TSA is a waste of their money, so politicians keep the job subsidy rolling because the alternative is having to explain why they cut "security" funding.

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#48

Post by JustSomeNobody » Tue, Apr 02, 2019, 9:07 PM UTC

rajbot wrote: post #41

JustSomeNobody wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe keep the card of Apple's lawyers on your person. If you're in a situation like this, have them call the number. Or clarify Apple's policy on this before traveling.

His request to call his employer or an attorney was denied: > I asked the agents if I could speak to my employer or an attorney before unlocking my devices. This request seemed to aggravate the customs officers. They informed me that I had no right to speak to an attorney at the border despite being a U.S. citizen, and threatened me that failure to immediately comply with their demand is a violation of federal crimin…

I missed that point. Thank you for correcting me.

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#49

Post by _bxg1 » Tue, Apr 02, 2019, 9:07 PM UTC

jacquesm wrote: post #40

_bxg1 wrote: post #37

Every time an article like this pops up (seems like a couple times a month now), I'm validated in my decision to donate monthly to the ACLU. They're always mentioned as fighting this stuff on the front lines.

Every time an article like this pops up I am validated in my decision to no longer travel to the United States.

Touche

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#50

Post by BeetleB » Tue, Apr 02, 2019, 9:08 PM UTC

rajbot wrote: post #35

> The agents proceeded to search my belongings and demanded that I unlock my smartphone and laptop. This was rather concerning for me. My phone and laptop are property of my employer and contain unreleased software and proprietary information. I’ve signed a non-disclosure agreement promising not to give anyone access. His employer is Apple. I was always worried about this same scenario when traveling with an Apple-ow…

>His employer is Apple. I was always worried about this same scenario when traveling with an Apple-owned laptop..

Does Apple not have a policy for this? I would suggest asking them.

I asked my employer when I joined (even though my job had absolutely zero international travel). They had a simple policy: Always comply with law enforcement in whatever country you're in: If they want me to enter my laptop password, my company directs me to cooperate.

It would be scary if Apple does not have a policy on this.