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No one should have to travel in fear

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Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#21

Post by geofft »

jbhatab wrote: post #3

Fantastic that he posted his experience, but it sounded like a pretty standard experience with authorities for many Americans. Genuinely curious why this is news compared to what happens to many other people?

As a Global Entry holder myself I expect that because the government has done a background check on me, has my fingerprints, etc., it generally understands that (despite my Indian skin, unshaved stubble, and vote for Hillary) I am not a threat. I have voluntarily subjected myself the government conducting a background check and holding files / information on me in exchange for less hassle. So part of it is that it's baffling they would detain a Global Entry holder and effectively remove his Global Entry status without explanation.

(For what it's worth, I helped my family move cross-country by car in summer 2016; we passed a "border" checkpoint in New Mexico or so, on I-10 relatively far from the border, where they stopped each car, asked us if we were citizens, and let us go on our way when I answered yes. That seems like a much more "standard" experience than what's here.)

Part of it is denial of a lawyer. As I understand it, you might not have a right to deny the search, but you should still have access to counsel, because the point of legal representation is that they can tell you exactly what rights you do / don't have.

Part of it is an apparent government focus on Mozilla. Andreas Gal hasn't been at Mozilla for about four years, but that's what they asked him about. And there was the visa denial for Daniel Stenberg (author of curl) when heading to the Mozilla all-hands: https://daniel.haxx.se/blog/2018/07/28/administrative-purgat...

And finally, part of it is that it shouldn't be common. It's a good reason for individuals and companies to leave America.

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#22

Post by CalChris »

cobbzilla wrote: post #5

It's horrible but the case-law seems fairly well settled; various courts have ruled that lots of searches that would otherwise violate the 4th Amendment are totally permissible for CBP agents within 100 miles of the border and at customs checkpoints within international airports. I'd love to be surprised if there is a legitimate case here.

That wouldn't extend to punatively confiscating his Global Entry card.

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#23

Post by komali2 »

Dunno what to do about this. I think TSA is a sham and a waste of my money. I think border control is taking my money and using it to abuse people. I don't think it's ok that I can pay to avoid the poor people line at the airport.

I've written my reps and the president, I call about once a month, but it has no measurable effect. Smarter people than me have done audits on TSA and published them in famous newspapers to show how useless they are. There's people fighting against CBP locking up asylum seekers but it still happens.

Dunno what to do. Partner and I are considering abandoning the USA.

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#24

Post by geofft »

cobbzilla wrote: post #5

It's horrible but the case-law seems fairly well settled; various courts have ruled that lots of searches that would otherwise violate the 4th Amendment are totally permissible for CBP agents within 100 miles of the border and at customs checkpoints within international airports. I'd love to be surprised if there is a legitimate case here.

Sure, but you should still have the right to have a lawyer confirm that for you, no? The entire reason we have the right to legal representation is that individuals are not expected to understand all the case law in the country. A lawyer can totally say "Yeah, they're allowed to search you, unlock your phone"—but the ability to confirm that with a lawyer is an important right.

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#25

Post by pgeorgi »

Mizza wrote: post #4

Is this something we need to petition congress to fix? Do CBP agents have the right to search the electronic devices of US citizens without a search warrant or not?

I guess the problem is less their desire to search the devices (even though it might still be a problem) and more the "3 armed brutes making demands and refusing access to a lawyer".

The latter sounds more like thuggery than rule of law.

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#26

Post by [deleted] »

komali2 wrote: post #23

Dunno what to do about this. I think TSA is a sham and a waste of my money. I think border control is taking my money and using it to abuse people. I don't think it's ok that I can pay to avoid the poor people line at the airport. I've written my reps and the president, I call about once a month, but it has no measurable effect. Smarter people than me have done audits on TSA and published them in famous newspapers to…

[deleted]

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#27

Post by sithadmin »

Rafuino wrote: post #20

Going on a trip in the short term and just got a phone with facial recognition unlock. I think it's important to turn this feature off before returning to the US as it could easily be misused in this exact situation.

Disable biometric auths of any kind, and turn the phone off before approaching CBP.

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#28

Post by caprese »

> The customs agents did however keep my Global Entry card as a punishment

?????

You never need your global entry card at airport customs because your flight information is encoded to your passport, which the machine scans.

Was that supposed to be punishment? Why did he even have it? Does the Global Entry number still work and automatically give you TSA Pre on the new tickets you purchase?

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#29

Post by hluska »

dragonwriter wrote: post #16

Here's the thing: If it was a legitimate search with real public security purpose, there is no excuse for letting him go without completing the search. If it was not a legitimate search with real public purpose, there is no excuse for the threats or retaliation. Irrespective of the legitimacy of the search, the behavior here is unjustifiable.

Wonderfully written summary. Great job and great points!

Re: No one should have to travel in fear

#30

Post by zachr »

jbhatab wrote: post #3

Fantastic that he posted his experience, but it sounded like a pretty standard experience with authorities for many Americans. Genuinely curious why this is news compared to what happens to many other people?

The fact that this happens at all should be constantly in the news. This is unconstitutional treatment of a US citizen and CBP clearly needs oversight.
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