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Laptops to Stay in Bags as TSA Brings New Technology to Airports

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Re: Laptops to Stay in Bags as TSA Brings New Technology to Airports

#131

Post by js2 »

lordleft wrote: post #2

The moment I pull out my ipad and macbook and entrust the fate of around 3000 dollars worth of electronics to the competence and benevolence of government officials who barely give a shit is my least favorite part of the travel experience

I accidentally left my MacBook in the bin at MIA. I didn’t notice till I got home a few states away. It made it to lost and found and my father was able to pick it up for me. I was pretty shocked. This was before Pre. Since I’ve had Pre it’s not necessary to remove the laptop.

Re: Laptops to Stay in Bags as TSA Brings New Technology to Airports

#132

Post by rhizome »

smelendez wrote: post #78
jkqwzsoo wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At one point, I was travelling with my dad when the "shoes off" policy was relaxed (I think the shoes-off policy was relaxed a couple of weeks/months after the shoe bomber plot, but I can't recall exactly when -- and then it was put back permanently). "Agent": Sir, I recommend you take your shoes off. Dad: That's okay. I don't need to take my shoes off. "Agent": Sir, I'm going to need you to take your shoes off NOW!…

I've seen this sort of things in videos of police encounters, too. "I suggest you do X" or "would you mind doing X" is some officers' way of being polite, but it leads to dangerous misunderstandings. When people say no, taking the statement literally, cops see them as trying to start a fight. I'd love to see law enforcement trained in using basic, declarative sentences: "Sir, regulation X.Y.Z says you have to take yo…

Don't say "no," don't be confrontational, don't say anything. They'll be obvious about it if it's not optional.

Re: Laptops to Stay in Bags as TSA Brings New Technology to Airports

#133

Post by chii »

issa wrote: post #95
robertAngst wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The moment we experience government, we see the inefficiencies, yet some people want to see government get larger. I just cannot understand the logic.

Government is great at some things. Unfortunately one of those things isn't dealing with fears rationally.

> dealing with fears rationally.

people as an individual also don't deal with fears rationally. This is exploited by those in power (or whoever that can) to further their own agenda - whether it's greed or control or whatever.

Re: Laptops to Stay in Bags as TSA Brings New Technology to Airports

#134

Post by mseidl »

btbuildem wrote: post #55

It's fascinating how the security theatre has gotten so big that now it basically just rolls forward under its own momentum. It's been around long enough that people accept it as normal, it serves no other purpose than to employ the unemployable and fill contractors' coffers, and it seems that no entity is able to stop or dismantle it.

I was flying form Twin Falls to L.A. and when I went through the metal detector I set it off. So, what to the TSA people do? They don't use the metal detector wand, they take some paper and rub it on my hands and put it in a machine to detect for explosive residue/powder...

Re: Laptops to Stay in Bags as TSA Brings New Technology to Airports

#135

Post by chii »

QualityReboot wrote: post #43
finaliteration wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know why, but for me it’s the shoes. My laptop bag makes it fairly easy to take my laptop out and put it back in, but dealing with taking my shoes on and off really fucking bugs me. It’s totally irrational, I know.

I think your feeling is pretty rational. It's pretty annoying for no benefit. I wish they also offered flights with lower security. I'm fine getting on a plane if everyone went through a metal detector and kept their shoes on.

> I'm fine getting on a plane if everyone went through a metal detector and kept their shoes on.

that's an interesting thought. May be if the price of a ticket could be made cheaper by cutting out these TSA bullshit, the market could correct this problem.

Re: Laptops to Stay in Bags as TSA Brings New Technology to Airports

#136

Post by chii »

ahupp wrote: post #104
godelski wrote: post #15

But when are we going to have the real discussion about security theater?

I guess by "theater" you mean that there's no actual purpose to taking your laptop out of the bag other than making people feel better? I have a hard time believing that's true. There's people who spend their whole career understanding airline security and (since I know nothing about it) I'm inclined to trust they aren't wasting my time.

These scans are theatre. Actual security is https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Y1kJpHBn50 , and most people in the USA would not agree with this sort of checks.

Re: Laptops to Stay in Bags as TSA Brings New Technology to Airports

#137

Post by 1000units »

mseidl wrote: post #134
btbuildem wrote: post #55

It's fascinating how the security theatre has gotten so big that now it basically just rolls forward under its own momentum. It's been around long enough that people accept it as normal, it serves no other purpose than to employ the unemployable and fill contractors' coffers, and it seems that no entity is able to stop or dismantle it.

I was flying form Twin Falls to L.A. and when I went through the metal detector I set it off. So, what to the TSA people do? They don't use the metal detector wand, they take some paper and rub it on my hands and put it in a machine to detect for explosive residue/powder...

I got pat down by an older gentleman. I jokingly said "I wish my girlfriend touched me like this" and then I was threatened with assault.

Re: Laptops to Stay in Bags as TSA Brings New Technology to Airports

#138

Post by jonas21 »

btbuildem wrote: post #55

It's fascinating how the security theatre has gotten so big that now it basically just rolls forward under its own momentum. It's been around long enough that people accept it as normal, it serves no other purpose than to employ the unemployable and fill contractors' coffers, and it seems that no entity is able to stop or dismantle it.

It's also interesting to compare the prevailing opinion here on the TSA with that of the FAA, given that they serve the same industry.

It appears that most people on HN feel that TSA regulations are pointless theater and should be weakened or eliminated, while the FAA is to be blamed for not exercising their regulatory power strongly enough (especially in light of the 737 MAX).

Both agencies seem to follow a similar methodology: when there's an incident, analyze the cause and enact regulations that would have prevented it, building up a system leads to fewer incidents over time. And they seem to have led to similar results -- over the past decade, there has been only one passenger fatality on commercial flights within the US due to accidents, and zero due to hijackings/bombings.

Why the difference in opinion? Is it that TSA regulations are personally annoying to travelers while FAA regulations are mostly invisible to passengers?

Re: Laptops to Stay in Bags as TSA Brings New Technology to Airports

#139

Post by doorbellguy »

vaishaksuresh wrote: post #32
narrator wrote: post #20

Just get TSA pre-check. It's so freaking easy and it makes airport security checkpoints not a big deal at all.

Works only for US citizens and Permanent Residents.

Here you go [1]. It's a lengthy and tedious process but it is there.

---

[1] https://www.cbp.gov/travel/trusted-traveler-programs/global-...

Re: Laptops to Stay in Bags as TSA Brings New Technology to Airports

#140

Post by Godel_unicode »

javagram wrote: post #108
AlexCoventry wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What exactly are they trying to prevent with the liquid prohibition, anyway?

Trying to prevent people carrying through chemicals that could be combined in the airplane bathroom to make explosives I believe. There was a terrorist plot to do this, which was caught by the security services, and then despite the terrorists being caught the liquids ban was put into place forever more to stop future attacks. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_transatlantic_aircraft_...

First, a slight clarification: while the main charge and the detonator were separated during transit and intended to be assembled on the plane, the explosive liquid itself was not a binary compound; it was live in the soft drink bottles.

It sounds like you're arguing that this regulation is not necessary any more because that particular plot was foiled. I find that line of reasoning odd, given that the 2006 attack was the last in a string of plots using liquid explosives to target airliners. The type of group which carried out attacks like this still exists, with similar goals.

Given that it's reasonably effective at deterring a technique which has actually been used (the Japan test run in the 90s) and which has been attempted multiple times, I think it's possibly the least objectionable regulation. It doesn't address all modes of attack (obviously), and it's very debatable whether the likelihood of attack makes the invasiveness of the countermeasure acceptable, but unlike body scanners it's at least effective at deterring the specific modality it's aimed at.

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