What Finally Killed AirPower • Hacker News Board

Re: What Finally Killed AirPower

#211

Post by rabidvermin » Sat, Mar 30, 2019, 12:59 PM UTC

coredog64 wrote: post #208

rexf wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I know many who almost never charge their phones, essentially always living at 5%. That's amazing since I'm the opposite. I always try to be near or at 100% (both phone & laptop) while I'm at my desk.

I do this too, so don’t take this as criticism. Isn’t this bad for the battery? ISTR you want to keep the battery between 20 and 80 percent. More than that and it winds up heating up the battery during charge. Or is that just for electric cars?

That was the case, I think, with old NiCd batteries, but with lithium ion batteries, you maximize battery longevity by keeping it mostly charged, I read recently.

Re: What Finally Killed AirPower

#212

Post by hoorayimhelping » Sat, Mar 30, 2019, 1:00 PM UTC

brian-armstrong wrote: post #11

So my phone is charged by a cable. It plugs into the wall on one side and then plugs into my phone on the other. This system works great - I plug my phone in when I go to bed and unplug it when I wake up. The cable is long enough to plug into my phone even if I want to use it in bed. It's easy, cheap and failproof. What is the draw of wireless charging? What is it that I'm missing? Did anyone ask for this?

>What is the draw of wireless charging? What is it that I'm missing? Did anyone ask for this?

Apple is trying to release a series of devices that don't need wires. Apple Watch, Airpods, removing the 3.5mm headphone jack. They're trying to make a sheet of glass a few millimeters thick that does computations, like you'd see in Star Trek. There's no big mystery to it.

Nobody asked Apple to remove 3.5inch floppies or optical drives; people freaked the fuck out for months when they did. Now, nobody cares or needs those things. This is how Apple operates. People (myself included) seem to forget that they do this all the time on their path to making great products.

Re: What Finally Killed AirPower

#213

Post by hopler » Sat, Mar 30, 2019, 1:14 PM UTC

pkulak wrote: post #116

accatyyc wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The things that kill smartphone batteries today are age and power cycles. It doesn’t matter if you charge from 0% to 100% in one go or from 90% to 100% ten times. Both add up to one power cycle. To keep your battery fresh for as long as possible, always keep the phone connected to a charger. No battery cycles. It will get worse after a few years anyway.

I dunno. All the EV manufacturers still recommend not charging to 100% daily.

EV batteries cost $5000+ to replace and are expected to last 7-10 years, maybe more if you push it. And they are a huge pain to recharge in the middle of the day if you suddenly need to. How many years do you plan to keep your phone for? Who cares if the battery only has 70% of original capacity after 3 years and on some days you need to find 20minutess in the middle of the day to leave it plugged in to recharge?

Re: What Finally Killed AirPower

#214

Post by hopler » Sat, Mar 30, 2019, 1:18 PM UTC

sfifs wrote: post #206

brian-armstrong wrote: post #11

So my phone is charged by a cable. It plugs into the wall on one side and then plugs into my phone on the other. This system works great - I plug my phone in when I go to bed and unplug it when I wake up. The cable is long enough to plug into my phone even if I want to use it in bed. It's easy, cheap and failproof. What is the draw of wireless charging? What is it that I'm missing? Did anyone ask for this?

So I used to think the same until one day I dramatically learned the utility of wireless charging. I was traveling on a 30 hour journey with two airplane changes from Asia to the US. Some combination of temperature and humidity changes led to condensation in the charging port my phone basically refused to charge from USB C irrespective of what I tried to dry it out. I barely managed to save enough battery to send a "…

Where did you travel to? Southeast Asia?

Re: What Finally Killed AirPower

#215

Post by hopler » Sat, Mar 30, 2019, 1:19 PM UTC

OriginalPenguin wrote: post #71

samtho wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cables are subject to breaking (specifically the connectors) and given how hard it is for many phones to listen to music via headphones and charge at the same time, I can see the appeal. Also, jacks are only rated for a limited number of cycles (connects, disconnects) due to the fact that there is mechanical connection taking place. In the future, I imagine wireless charging being built into key pieces of furniture (…

USB-C is rated for at least 10,000 disconnects. That's four connects/disconnects a day for more than six and a half years.

Cable or port? That's not a lot for a port.

Re: What Finally Killed AirPower

#216

Post by lttlrck » Sat, Mar 30, 2019, 1:21 PM UTC

Raidion wrote: post #209

bestnameever wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i've found what I believe to be the heat generated by wireless chargers to have a negative effect on my battery longevity. Personally, I avoid them now after being a huge advocate from them. The reality is, Battery life on phones have improved to the point that I also rarely need to charge my phone anymore other than what I'm about to go to sleep anyway.

It's not the heat, it's the increased use. when you're hardwired, you get enough power that your phone just bypasses the battery. If you use a charging mat, you still 'run' from battery. This means increased cycles which reduces battery life.

How is that?

If the battery is charging then logically there must be enough residual power to run the phone. If there wasn’t then the battery would not charge at all unless you turned off the phone first, but it obviously does.

Also a phone on a charging mat cannot easily be used and the screen will be off most of the time lowering power requirements.

Re: What Finally Killed AirPower

#217

Post by rorykoehler » Sat, Mar 30, 2019, 1:30 PM UTC

dorkwood wrote: post #186

oblio wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's called (mild) OCD and ordinary people don't suffer from it. Don't feel bad, I do the same, it seems to be a common trait in IT (anyone writing code kind of has to have it...).

If I don't keep my phone at 100% while at my desk, and then I go out somewhere after work, there's a chance my phone will run down to 0% while I'm out, potentially stranding me somewhere. I don't think that's OCD. It's just planning ahead.

What kind of phone do you have? I get 2 full days use on a charge. Surely you need a new battery instead?

Re: What Finally Killed AirPower

#218

Post by mikeash » Sat, Mar 30, 2019, 1:36 PM UTC

quotemstr wrote: post #135

isoskeles wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I want to give you the benefit of the doubt here, in what way did the ban on cellphones on planes stall progress ? It seemed more like a minor annoyance / inconvenience, but I could be misunderstanding or not have context.

One thing: it's become increasingly common to ditch in-seat entertainment units and just have people watch airline-provided entertainment on their own devices over wifi. This approach saves weight and money. Would it have been viable if electronic devices were still banned during takeoff? Regardless, utility matters. This argument from frivolity --- that we shouldn't allow thing X that has rare side effect Y because…

Personal devices were taking over from built in entertainment units long before the ban was lifted on portable electronic use below 10,000ft. Having an extra 20 minutes to use your own device doesn’t make that much of a difference.

Re: What Finally Killed AirPower

#219

Post by colejohnson66 » Sat, Mar 30, 2019, 1:42 PM UTC

pjc50 wrote: post #160

NeedMoreTea wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is what I never understood, even slightly. Why not just give an iPod / iPhone dock without all the wireless bullshit? I prefer a dock as it holds phone at a handy angle, syncs, and doesn't have the myriad of drawbacks of bluetooth. Smartphone battery life is so shit, on every model, that I always plug my phone in. Even if the cable / socket is only going to be around for minutes. So no saving here. In the days o…

I'm still annoyed that Apple made an excellent dock connector, it became widespread especially in hotels, it was ideal for use with external speakers, and then killed it off.

You mean the (IMO) inferior 30-pin? In order to make the phone smaller, they had to ditch it. Also, they were running out of unused pins to assign to new functions

Re: What Finally Killed AirPower

#220

Post by mikeash » Sat, Mar 30, 2019, 1:42 PM UTC

judge2020 wrote: post #75

quotemstr wrote: post #36

> The FCC rules for wireless charging devices like AirPower are quite strict, and limit exposure to 20 cm (8 in) above the device to 50 mW/cm^2. Who's to say that 50 mW/cm^2 is the right field strength limit? Remember when we couldn't use cell phones on airplanes during takeoff because of the theoretical possibility that something, somewhere might interfere? As it turns out, there was no interference problem, cell ph…

You would risk even one pacemaker failing in light of 'technical progress'?

We're already risking that. The regulatory limits aren’t a 100% guarantee of safety, they’re just an effort to make a good tradeoff between safety and utility.

There’s no guarantee that all pacemakers will accept interference that falls below the regulatory limit, nor is there a guarantee that every certified device actually complies with the limit. Manufacturing defects or gaps in testing mean you can never be totally sure. If your standard is to not risk even one pacemaker failing due to outside interference, you would need to eliminate all other electronics. (And you’d still have the unlikely but non-zero risk that one pacemaker would emit interference that causes another one to fail.)