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History of Biosphere 2

nytimes.com

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Re: History of Biosphere 2

#51

Post by kev009 »

pram wrote: post #14

I took a tour of Biosphere 2 when I was young. I remember the guide talking about two specific problems they didn't anticipate that dramatically altered the outcome of the experiment: The 'domes' are supported by a metal lattice framework. That structure actually blocked too much sun and created extra shade which affected the plant growth. The concrete used in the construction was sucking up carbon dioxide and changi…

I toured it when I was young as well. I remember being enamored with the bunch of Sun workstations they had.

Re: History of Biosphere 2

#52

Post by mikeash »

jasonwatkinspdx wrote: post #25
maxxxxx wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This just shows that we have to do a lot of tedious testing before there is a chance to go to Mars. Even pretty innocent looking things can cause huge problems that can’t be anticipated beforehand

I always get downvoted to oblivion for pointing this out, but the Elon Musk hype squad is just not being realistic about how far we are from establishing a permanent colony on mars. Severe issues remain.

If (and this is still a big if) you can send a hundred tons to Mars for a few dozen million dollars, a Mars colony should become totally doable. A self-sufficient colony is a whole different matter, but it doesn’t have to be self-sufficient.

Re: History of Biosphere 2

#53

Post by simonh »

gryfft wrote: post #27
jasonwatkinspdx wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I always get downvoted to oblivion for pointing this out, but the Elon Musk hype squad is just not being realistic about how far we are from establishing a permanent colony on mars. Severe issues remain.

A Mars colony is something humanity should start thinking seriously about once we successfully run a production-grade lunar colony for about a decade-- long enough to recognize and tackle the worst bugs.

The trouble is many of the problems of living in those environments are very different. Mars does have an atmosphere, which means cheap abundant CO2. It has much stronger gravity. The numerology is completely different. The moon’s vacuum environment is much harsher with starker temperature differences. It looks like sharp moon dust will be a significant abrasion risk to equipment - not a problem on Mars. Also while both have water ice, the methods for extraction will likely be very different.

Re: History of Biosphere 2

#54

Post by mirimir »

adrianN wrote: post #36
maxxxxx wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This just shows that we have to do a lot of tedious testing before there is a chance to go to Mars. Even pretty innocent looking things can cause huge problems that can’t be anticipated beforehand

IMHO Biosphere 2 was not a realistic experiment for a self-sustained off-world colony. They tried to to mimic a complex self-regulating biosphere and failed. The pragmatic approach is going with a tightly controlled artificial ecosystem with the absolute minimum number of species and heavy technological involvement. The russian BIOS-3 is a much better model for a Mars colony.

Yes, this is the key point. Biosphere 2 had too many conflicting goals. Species diversity is cool and all. But if your goal is even century-scale self-sufficiency, you arguably you don't need pieces of so many ecosystems. I mean, what do bush babies really do for you?

Cockroaches are a tough problem. And management of soil microbes. But maybe the most practical solution is to gamma sterilize all bulk inputs, and carefully seed with just what you want.

Re: History of Biosphere 2

#56

Post by t3hprofit »

jayess wrote: post #12
nobody_nowhere wrote: post #4

I toured the facility around 2005-6 (iirc). Looks like you still can. It had a futuristic and lightly post-apocalyptic vibe. The jungle plants were growing out of control, pressing up against the glass panes of one of the habitats. Ants streamed in and out from the desert outside through a crack in a glass panel. If you check it out ( http://biosphere2.org/visit/tour-schedule-hours ), you can have a full post-apocaly…

I highly recommend the ICBM museum in Tuscon. They go through the entire launch process for the tour. It takes less than a minute. It's quite something to imagine that within that short period, the end of civilization would be guaranteed.

Did the ICBM tour w/ a dad a few years back. It's definitely fascinating. 100% agreed worth the time

Re: History of Biosphere 2

#57

Post by aetherson »

maxxxxx wrote: post #28
gryfft wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A Mars colony is something humanity should start thinking seriously about once we successfully run a production-grade lunar colony for about a decade-- long enough to recognize and tackle the worst bugs.

True. On moon you still have a chance to quickly send some new parts which you can’t do on mars.

Quicker, sure. Though not particularly cheaper. And the moon has a bunch of problems that Mars doesn't, like 14 day nights. The moon's advantages are probably seem intuitively somewhat larger than they actually are.

Re: History of Biosphere 2

#60

Post by jws »

nobody_nowhere wrote: post #50
jws wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And while you are enjoying a buffet of extinction level mass homicide, I always recommend a stop at Rooster Cogburn’s Ostrich Ranch between Tucson and Phoenix. Check the internet, they aren’t open every day. But you can spend an hour feeding tiny livestock, giant nightmare birds, and end up covered in lorikeets. (Hint: the fallow deer have gross saliva. Feed them before the Sicilian donkeys. The donkeys will clean yo…

The ostriches are vicious! They had that pail of feed ripped out of my hand and spread on the ground before I could even flinch.

Yeah, there are little plastic chutes in the fence for feeding them. I noticed those after I successfully and painfully retrieved my right coding hand from inside the head of one of those nightmare birds.
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