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I Miss Rails

chanind.github.io

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Re: I Miss Rails

#281

Post by peteforde »

tomc1985 wrote: post #261
peteforde wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The funniest part about the enthusiasm for React masochism is that the best parts of the library are better accomplished with a combination of Turbolinks 5 and Stimulus. Not a coincidence that they're all Rails extractions. For me, the more interesting question in all of this is where did this fervour for JS-and-the-way-down actually come from? My hypothesis is that it's the natural result of a huge mess of new talen…

I think it's that, and the general accessibility of Javascript. Before this JS craze you saw the same shit with PHP and Visual Basic, though for the most part people weren't trying to build and rebuild the same platforms nearly as much as now

I know that it's 2008 calling, but seriously: when did Heroku, Github and the bundler/gem ecosystem stop qualifying as accessible? Deploying an MVP Rails app with sophisticated functionality is so effective that it still qualifies as erotic.

For me, the most compelling example of progress coming from the JS camp was my shallow investigation of the Expo platform for React Native. It has some genuinely sexy developer ergonomics features which I'd love to see make their way back into Rails.

Re: I Miss Rails

#282

Post by dluan »

reilly3000 wrote: post #63

I really have no horse in this race, but I would like to know what the argument FOR React+Redux+GraphQL is for developing apps in 2019. Is it that we need to offer offline clients to meet user expectations? Better raw performance on the front end? Cheaper server costs or easier to deploy serverlessly? For the progressive enhancement of your resume?

For a straightforward well constrained app, the complaint against rails is usually performance. But it breaks down as soon as the well constrained app has to be maintained or grown for any amount of time past typical JS dependency hell.

Rails/ruby perf is getting better with some new work in ruby with JIT and memory. It's got its work cut out to match up with Go, Elixir, or Node, but compared to the rest of the options, it also has a huge head start on some other basic things like community and support.

Re: I Miss Rails

#283

Post by james_s_tayler »

rohan404 wrote: post #188
rashkov wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I know, there's no official way of using Devise over a REST API. It is designed with a server-side Rails app in mind. There's devise_token_auth and related client libraries, but I wish there was an official way for handling authentication for single-page apps. Every time I look into this issue, it seems like there isn't much going on in this space. Then again, maybe the entire authentication protocols space…

It's true that there isn't an official way to use Devise over REST, but then again Devise isn't even the official way to manage auth in Rails apps - it just happens to be the de facto one due to community support. That being said, by using something like devise_token_auth/simple_token_authentication and devise-two-factor you can have a token based auth system with MFA ready in a matter of minutes. Personally, I don't…

ASPNET Identity and Spring Security to name a few.

Re: I Miss Rails

#284

Post by aaronbrethorst »

davidbanham wrote: post #132

I actually have gone back to writing server-rendered apps like it's 2012 and it's been wonderful. Server-rendered used to mean slow and clunky but I've found that using Go my page loads are super fast. The inter-page transitions can sting a little on really really slow connections, it's true. But users are much more willing to deal with them if they haven't first been subjected to a minutes-long spinner while the SPA…

SSR + Pjax + React on the components that really need it seems like a much-simpler combination to me than what seems to be generally considered 'state of the art' these days.

Re: I Miss Rails

#285

Post by rco8786 »

Rails is still very much alive and popular, this is kind of a weird take. Server rendering is also very much still a thing.

But I do agree that it seems the JS ecosystem is missing a real Rails equivalent. Specifically an ORM that is as robust as ActiveRecord. I've often thought about building this myself, and then I remember I have a family and full time job.

Re: I Miss Rails

#286

Post by continuational »

strken wrote: post #136
tomc1985 wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rails is FANTASTIC! I work on a hybrid React-on-Rails application and working on the React portions is so. fucking. painful. Seriously the shit people come up with with this "tool" makes corporate-hack Java programmers look good. I am always taking the backend Rails-y tickets if I have the chance

Blaming complexity on React is a bit like blaming complexity on ERB. The problem isn't React, the problem is the massive hole where React doesn't have an opinion. React improves the area around the hole so much that the technologies we use to fill the void look obviously deficient in comparison.

Not quite true - React confuses inputs with outputs by taking in callbacks as props instead of just emitting events. This makes shouldComponentUpdate very error prone, and memoizing callbacks to work around it is a mess. This is a large contributor to complexity and bugs in React apps.

Re: I Miss Rails

#287

Post by wwweston »

strken wrote: post #136
tomc1985 wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rails is FANTASTIC! I work on a hybrid React-on-Rails application and working on the React portions is so. fucking. painful. Seriously the shit people come up with with this "tool" makes corporate-hack Java programmers look good. I am always taking the backend Rails-y tickets if I have the chance

Blaming complexity on React is a bit like blaming complexity on ERB. The problem isn't React, the problem is the massive hole where React doesn't have an opinion. React improves the area around the hole so much that the technologies we use to fill the void look obviously deficient in comparison.

That's a great observation -- one that's true of, say, jQuery too, which handled the problems of cross browser compatibility, over-verbose interfaces, and DOM manipulation so well that... we got to really take a hard look at the problem of doing everything we wanted by direct DOM manipulation.

Re: I Miss Rails

#288

Post by pmontra »

pwim wrote: post #163
hombre_fatal wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Static-typing seems so at odds with Ruby/Rails that I can't even imagine what that would look like.

Stripe has built a type checker for Ruby that they're using internally. I don't think it has been released yet, but you can get a preview of it at https://sorbet.run/ .

So it's something along the lines of Erlang / Elixir dialyzer. I don't like it much (dialyzer) because of the verbosity and unDRYness. Every function definition becomes two lines and the name of the function is repeated in both. Type names are longer than they should and are separated from argument names.

We had a discussion about Ruby's type annotations 4 years ago at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9481186

I found it by googling the status of the work on Ruby 3 type annotations. The top comment is mine and I still agree with the past myself.

Re: I Miss Rails

#289

Post by wwweston »

BillFranklin wrote: post #6

> if the modern equivalent of Rails already exists, please let me know! You're in luck. Rails 5.2.3 was released 20 hours ago. More seriously, I feel rails is still excellent and I'm happy to work with it every day. I'd be interested to hear more about what makes rails not modern? I find it a very productive framework. EDIT: If you're talking about missing a JS equivalent of rails, do you know about Loopback? https:/…

Let's say the last time I really worked on anything Rails related was 2011-ish, and while I got stuff done OK, I never really particularly fell in love with it (and in fact was often annoyed that most projects I worked on seemed to start with a week of hacking through environment and gem snarls).

Where would people recommend I read about (a) getting up and running with rails 5 and (b) appreciating what's new and improved in the last 8 years?

Re: I Miss Rails

#290

Post by _vuqm »

Every single example the OP laid out is solved by an official laravel package. People love to hate on PHP but I can spin up a laravel app with all of those features in a matter of hours.

I can build a traditional server side rendered app or I can use the front end scaffolding to build an API driven SPA based on vue or react.

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