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1100 layoffs at Bay Area tech companies

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Re: 1100 layoffs at Bay Area tech companies

#21

Left out Imperva, which was bought by Thoma Bravo in January. 150 people let go while the CEO makes $15 million. Mismanaged incentives - employees don't matter, just shareholders.

Umm... these are corporations. They are owned by shareholders and exist for the benefit of shareholders. I don’t see any subterfuge here.

Re: 1100 layoffs at Bay Area tech companies

#22

Left out Imperva, which was bought by Thoma Bravo in January. 150 people let go while the CEO makes $15 million. Mismanaged incentives - employees don't matter, just shareholders.

Any company where the CEO makes over 25 times the average worker is mismanaged. Are they honestly suggesting that the CEO gets 200 times more work in, or has 200 times the experience, or maybe 200 times the connections? Or some combination? Which is it?

Re: 1100 layoffs at Bay Area tech companies

#23

Left out Imperva, which was bought by Thoma Bravo in January. 150 people let go while the CEO makes $15 million. Mismanaged incentives - employees don't matter, just shareholders.

Any company where the CEO makes over 25 times the average worker is mismanaged. Are they honestly suggesting that the CEO gets 200 times more work in, or has 200 times the experience, or maybe 200 times the connections? Or some combination? Which is it?

What the CEO really has is 200x the affect on the company. A 15m bonus for a CEO may sound ridiculous but if picking that CEO led the company to 50m increase in revenue over an average CEO than it was well worth it to hire them.

Or at least, that's how CEOs sell themselves. I think that idea makes sense, but only if the company does well. If it doesn't the execs still have the power to grant themselves massive bonuses before the shareholders can react.

It's kind of like the classic 2% fee investment manager, they'll say they are the best at what they do, when of course they almost never beat the market. Still, regardless of how they do, they make bank. I think what really needs to happen is people need to learn to stop trusting people just because they talk smooth and make an optimistic pitch, and start focusing executive salaries on being entirely results based, with only a modest base salary.

Re: 1100 layoffs at Bay Area tech companies

#24

Left out Imperva, which was bought by Thoma Bravo in January. 150 people let go while the CEO makes $15 million. Mismanaged incentives - employees don't matter, just shareholders.

Any company where the CEO makes over 25 times the average worker is mismanaged. Are they honestly suggesting that the CEO gets 200 times more work in, or has 200 times the experience, or maybe 200 times the connections? Or some combination? Which is it?

Hell, i'm a VP at a public company and the president of my division makes 25 times what I do, never mind the average worker.

Re: 1100 layoffs at Bay Area tech companies

#25
post #16
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, that's the idea of Marx.

Marx had a lot of ideas; some of them were probably good. Involving workers in the ownership of companies seems like a good idea even if Marx supported it. Marxism as practiced in places like, eg, Russia fell down because they disrupted the ability of the market to send and receive accurate price signals and over time that led to catastrophically misallocated resources. Many of the people who want socialism seem to s…

As implemented in the current US economy, those price signals are also suppressed through collusion, cronyism, and near monopolies so it's not an exclusive issue of socialism implementations.

Many markets are stagnant and do not offer healthy competition. There's a fair share of markets that still offer healthy competition, but from my perspective, it seems like the end goal of market optimization almost inevitably leads to monopolization which always leads to stagnation.

True competition and an informed/economically conscious consumer market are key requirements to this signaling process. We don't have a lot of either in many markets.

Re: 1100 layoffs at Bay Area tech companies

#27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they are not majority shareholders, losing their job will probably have more impact than the share gains.

Well, that's the idea of Lenin.

Rochdale Pioneers Actually :-)

Yes I do know there where precursors to worker coops in Italy prior to that.

Re: 1100 layoffs at Bay Area tech companies

#28
post #16
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, that's the idea of Marx.

Marx had a lot of ideas; some of them were probably good. Involving workers in the ownership of companies seems like a good idea even if Marx supported it. Marxism as practiced in places like, eg, Russia fell down because they disrupted the ability of the market to send and receive accurate price signals and over time that led to catastrophically misallocated resources. Many of the people who want socialism seem to s…

> Russia fell down because they disrupted the ability of the market to send and receive accurate price signals and over time that led to catastrophically misallocated resources.

This is extremely ahistorical. The fall of the USSR was due to Gorbachev's decision to introduce "western" markets into Russia and Yeltsin's opportunism. Growth and stability weren't flagging in the Soviet Union until they attempted to privatize.

Re: 1100 layoffs at Bay Area tech companies

#29
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any company where the CEO makes over 25 times the average worker is mismanaged. Are they honestly suggesting that the CEO gets 200 times more work in, or has 200 times the experience, or maybe 200 times the connections? Or some combination? Which is it?

What the CEO really has is 200x the affect on the company. A 15m bonus for a CEO may sound ridiculous but if picking that CEO led the company to 50m increase in revenue over an average CEO than it was well worth it to hire them. Or at least, that's how CEOs sell themselves. I think that idea makes sense, but only if the company does well. If it doesn't the execs still have the power to grant themselves massive bonuse…

If I've learned anything in my life, it's that confidence trumps competence when it comes to most people making judgement evaluations. People love confidence and falsely correlate it with competence (maybe it's an old survival trait we humans inherited before manipulative language came about).

If you're competent, you likely hesitate because most cases are truly not clear cut when viewed through a lens of knowledge with a conscious.

It's easy to come off as confident when you're ignorant or know that simply appearing confident has a positive effect. The real key is to be competent and hide your hesitations/in decisions with confidence. The real problem is discerning which a person is: ignorant, manipulative, or a great leader--so confidence isn't a good measure for me. The only good measure is a historical record of good decisions or clear communication from leadership.

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