Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Told U.S. security at risk, Chinese firm seeks to sell Grindr dating app

reuters.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 114 posts

Re: Told U.S. security at risk, Chinese firm seeks to sell Grindr dating app

#21

Post by killjoywashere »

devy wrote: post #11
mrbonner wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They could use the info collected from users who happening to have state secrets (def-cons, state employees, etc...). The bottom line is that the Chinese could use this fact to blackmail those users to cough up what they know in exchange for forceful "coming out of a closet" announcement.

The first line of the article reads: ... Chinese gaming company Beijing Kunlun Tech Co Ltd is seeking to sell Grindr LLC, the popular gay dating app it has owned since 2016. So what's the point here? The Chinese gaming company has already owned it for over 2 years and have access to the data already.

Right, they got what they wanted out of it, so now they are just selling the trash. The fact that they're selling, coupled with the basis for the decision to sell, will probably crater the price. And I suspect this will have an adverse effect on Grindr's monthly-user count, which won't help that sale price. Wouldn't be surprised if Grindr folds. And that will have a deterrent effect on other companies interested in Chinese money. Because for the Chinese government, it ain't about the money.

Re: Told U.S. security at risk, Chinese firm seeks to sell Grindr dating app

#22

Post by Macross8299 »

yorwba wrote: post #10
mrbonner wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They could use the info collected from users who happening to have state secrets (def-cons, state employees, etc...). The bottom line is that the Chinese could use this fact to blackmail those users to cough up what they know in exchange for forceful "coming out of a closet" announcement.

Other dating apps also allow users to state their sexual preferences, so although Grindr might have a higher density of potential blackmail material, they're not even guaranteed to have the largest collection. There must be something else that sets them apart from others. (Maybe they were the first to be acquired by a Chinese company?)

My guess is the density of potential blackmail material _is_ what sets it apart from the others -- the very act of being registered on Grindr is almost a smoking gun for being non-heterosexual if you wanted to out somebody. Much better odds of finding a target that matches with your other info and much more "damning" evidence to scare people with.

edit: Furthermore, what other Chinese company owns a dating site used frequently by westerners?

Re: Told U.S. security at risk, Chinese firm seeks to sell Grindr dating app

#23

Post by CharlesColeman »

yorwba wrote: post #20
CharlesColeman wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What makes Grindr special in this regard ? I’m sure there are other dating or social apps out there that also could be foreign owned and used for espionage....??? select opm.name, opm.address from opm_security_clearance_files opm join grindr_users grinder where grinder.phone_number = opm.phone_number and opm.clearance in ('SECRET', 'TOP SECRET', 'SCI'); If any of those people are in the closet, they could be suscep…

Replace grindr by some_other_site where some_other_site.orientation != 'straight' or some_other_site.fetish in (...) and it works out to the same result, no?

Yeah, definitely. I think it's arguable the same rational could even apply to a dating site for straight people. It would take a little more work and probably be less fruitful overall, but an adversary's intelligence agency could use it identify straight people (with security clearances) who may be trying to cheat on their spouses or whose marriage is disintegrating. Both of those situations could open someone up to manipulation (a honey trap [1], for instance).

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recruitment_of_spies#Love,_hon...

Re: Told U.S. security at risk, Chinese firm seeks to sell Grindr dating app

#25

Post by kyrieeschaton »

Left unspoken is that the behavior of users of the app is ipso facto a security risk, regardless of who happens to own the platform they're using. This was why the US historically was leery about employing homosexuals in security contexts - they are vulnerable to blackmail and engage in behavior that makes them physically vulnerable (eg anonymous chemsex) on top of that.

Re: Told U.S. security at risk, Chinese firm seeks to sell Grindr dating app

#26

Post by [deleted] »

CharlesColeman wrote: post #14
lskopwol wrote: post #3

What makes Grindr special in this regard ? I’m sure there are other dating or social apps out there that also could be foreign owned and used for espionage....???

> What makes Grindr special in this regard ? I’m sure there are other dating or social apps out there that also could be foreign owned and used for espionage....??? select opm.name, opm.address from opm_security_clearance_files opm join grindr_users grinder where grinder.phone_number = opm.phone_number and opm.clearance in ('SECRET', 'TOP SECRET', 'SCI'); If any of those people are in the closet, they could be suscep…

[deleted]

Re: Told U.S. security at risk, Chinese firm seeks to sell Grindr dating app

#27

Post by amaccuish »

kyrieeschaton wrote: post #25

Left unspoken is that the behavior of users of the app is ipso facto a security risk, regardless of who happens to own the platform they're using. This was why the US historically was leery about employing homosexuals in security contexts - they are vulnerable to blackmail and engage in behavior that makes them physically vulnerable (eg anonymous chemsex) on top of that.

And straight people can't be blackmailed or engage in chemsex? There's a pile of examples of such cases, just check Wikipedia.

Re: Told U.S. security at risk, Chinese firm seeks to sell Grindr dating app

#28

Post by fromthestart »

make3 wrote: post #17

I wonder if the same owner as Tinder and OkCupid will buy this, becoming a dating (and casual sex, and etc.) superpower. I always thought funny how OkCupid pushes ads like "You're tired of the dirty flesh market of Tinder? We hear you! Come use OkCupid!" and they have the same owner as Tinder

It makes sense, okcupid and tinder target, perhaps unintentionally at first, different markets by virtue of their different images and interactions.

And they're sufficiently different to seem like totally independent dating pools, so people are probably going to fork up cash for both even if they get ads on one of them for the other.

Re: Told U.S. security at risk, Chinese firm seeks to sell Grindr dating app

#29

Post by daniel-cussen »

killjoywashere wrote: post #19

Nice to see someone taking the Chinese foothold in SV seriously. I've also heard people who go to work for Chinese companies are then blacklisted from US Government defense- and intel-related work for 1 year. Can anyone confirm?

> blacklisted from US Government defense- and intel-related work for 1 year

While I don't have the knowledge to confirm or deny this, I find it pretty lenient of the US not only because it's only a year, but also because it's open enough about it. Keeping in mind Aurora and the Lockheed Martin F35 hack, and that national security opposing a superpower is not a problem that solves itself, I find it does not undermine American values or freedoms.

Re: Told U.S. security at risk, Chinese firm seeks to sell Grindr dating app

#30

Post by wwweston »

make3 wrote: post #17

I wonder if the same owner as Tinder and OkCupid will buy this, becoming a dating (and casual sex, and etc.) superpower. I always thought funny how OkCupid pushes ads like "You're tired of the dirty flesh market of Tinder? We hear you! Come use OkCupid!" and they have the same owner as Tinder

It's generally best to be reserved about trusting any business to put principle or mission ahead of financial rewards, so, yeah, it's probably not true that OkCupid's owners (present or past) were not in their hearts mission-focused around substance over photo-swipe matching techniques and business success just came naturally.

That said, there's nothing particularly inconsistent about having different product lines and brands for different market segments. I don't think much of any of the Swipe-to-Date apps, but lots of people seem to. Some people seem to prefer OKC. Some people would rather buy a Lexus than a Toyota, or Pizza Hut over Taco Bell.

Post reply on HN