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Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

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Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#141

Post by TulliusCicero »

amaccuish wrote: post #125
btrettel wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cyclist here. I'm amazed by how much money people spend on their vehicles. I have an expensive bike (about $1000 new), and aside from perhaps $100-$200 on maintenance and equipment per year, I spend nothing else for daily transportation. It's hard for cars to compete with that on cost. I think suspending someone's drivers' license due to debts could help reduce one's transportation spending. Unfortunately, much of th…

Upvoting because people seem to be unable to read the caveat at the end of your post.

Likely they saw him 'bashing cars' and immediately downvoted. People on HN tend to reflexively downvote opinions like this as unrealistic (if it was non-reflexive, they would've seen the caveat at the end there).

Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#142

Post by coldtea »

AmVess wrote: post #32

USA is heading down this road, too. 21 states will suspend your driver's license if you fall behind on student debt. This is ass backwards and destructive thinking. I am certain this is just the start of greater restrictions on the unfortunate.

>USA is heading down this road, too. 21 states will suspend your driver's license if you fall behind on student debt.

How are those two connected?!

And what if you need to have a car to ...keep a job and pay your debt (seeing that many cities are built for cars, and not everyone has the luxury to live close to work, or even have a basic public transport).

Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#143

Post by TulliusCicero »

PhasmaFelis wrote: post #64
btrettel wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cyclist here. I'm amazed by how much money people spend on their vehicles. I have an expensive bike (about $1000 new), and aside from perhaps $100-$200 on maintenance and equipment per year, I spend nothing else for daily transportation. It's hard for cars to compete with that on cost. I think suspending someone's drivers' license due to debts could help reduce one's transportation spending. Unfortunately, much of th…

I'm also a cyclist, and spent most of my life biking exclusively, but not everyone is in a position to replace their car. If your car commute is 45 minutes on the highway, a bicycle is not going to help you when you lose your license.

Right, and a 45 minute car commute that can't be replaced by public transit is...well, not uniquely American, but certainly a hell of a lot more common in the US than most other developed countries.

Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#144

Post by btrettel »

Tomte wrote: post #135
PhasmaFelis wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm also a cyclist, and spent most of my life biking exclusively, but not everyone is in a position to replace their car. If your car commute is 45 minutes on the highway, a bicycle is not going to help you when you lose your license.

Even much shorter distances, say, five kilometers. Don't forget health and fitness. It's always cringy when bike activists just assume that everybody can get to work on a bike fast and without sweating. Yes, if they started now, many could do that in a few months. But the whole discussion tends to veer into fat shaming real quick.

Your views of bike activists do not match my experience.

> It's always cringy when bike activists just assume that everybody can get to work on a bike fast and without sweating.

My experience is that people tend to have an inaccurate view of what bike activists believe. I think few would say that most people can switch to cycling without major issues.

As for sweating, my experience is that cyclists tend to argue that some sweating is acceptable, not that people won't sweat. I can recall some people discussing how to reduce how much you sweat to a minimum, but I can't recall anyone claiming that you won't sweat at all.

> But the whole discussion tends to veer into fat shaming real quick.

Having participated in and observed many conversations about cycling, I can't recall that happening once. Can you point out an example?

Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#145

Post by TulliusCicero »

Tomte wrote: post #135
PhasmaFelis wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm also a cyclist, and spent most of my life biking exclusively, but not everyone is in a position to replace their car. If your car commute is 45 minutes on the highway, a bicycle is not going to help you when you lose your license.

Even much shorter distances, say, five kilometers. Don't forget health and fitness. It's always cringy when bike activists just assume that everybody can get to work on a bike fast and without sweating. Yes, if they started now, many could do that in a few months. But the whole discussion tends to veer into fat shaming real quick.

With ebikes these days, you probably can. And you can generally adjust how much assistance they give to match your circumstances.

Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#146

Post by coldtea »

massivecali wrote: post #45
AmVess wrote: post #32

USA is heading down this road, too. 21 states will suspend your driver's license if you fall behind on student debt. This is ass backwards and destructive thinking. I am certain this is just the start of greater restrictions on the unfortunate.

As I've been reminded countless times, "driving is a privilege not a right". You can lose your license for all kinds of 'unfair' reasons that do not make sense, and I agree it's heavy handed to include student loan debt, but until it is Federally acknowledged that all citizens have a right to drive (after passing proper license tests), then this downward progression will continue. In California you can't even registe…

>As I've been reminded countless times, "driving is a privilege not a right".

That's just a BS saying, not some rule of nature.

Societies should define what is a privilege and what is a right.

Do you think if there was a referendum on this specific matter (and not tied to 200 other policy questions, like general elections are), people would vote that "yeah, indeed driving is a privilege"?

Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#147

Post by [deleted] »

amaccuish wrote: post #125
btrettel wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cyclist here. I'm amazed by how much money people spend on their vehicles. I have an expensive bike (about $1000 new), and aside from perhaps $100-$200 on maintenance and equipment per year, I spend nothing else for daily transportation. It's hard for cars to compete with that on cost. I think suspending someone's drivers' license due to debts could help reduce one's transportation spending. Unfortunately, much of th…

Upvoting because people seem to be unable to read the caveat at the end of your post.

[deleted]

Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#148

Post by coldtea »

Tomte wrote: post #130
headcanon wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was once sitting in a courtroom for something unrelated and saw a 19 year old kid go to jail for 3 months for not paying child support. Not sure how he's going to pay it back in there, but if all you have is a hammer...

That's certainly not the first remedy that the court has taken. But say, if he hadn't been sent to prison, would he have paid child support then? We all don't know, but I strongly suspect no, and I strongly suspect the court has more than just my suspicions and calibrated its reaction accordingly.

>But say, if he hadn't been sent to prison, would he have paid child support then?

The amount could have been ordered to be taken from his bank account, or confiscated from his salary directly from his employer or payment system, or taken from his property.

There's absolutely nothing that necessitates that he is sent to prison if he merely can't pay.

Only if he has money and doesn't pay (and that after accounting for his food and rent expenses at a nominal minimal fee), or hides money that he could have used to pay.

Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#149

Post by ordu »

ConceitedCode wrote: post #117
ordu wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is a very american thing to say. I mean "it is bad, because it is regulated". Why? I suppose that social credit system of China is abused to make life of political opposition harder, but the article discussed is not about it. It shows case of a failed debtor. And for him it doesn't matter if social credit system is regulated or controlled by the market. What does matter for him is what impact this system has to hi…

Seems like there is a misunderstanding about the US credit system. Paying interest has 0 impact on your credit score. Plenty of ways to get a credit card without credit history (secured credit cards are typically easiest) and as long as you pay it off before the statement due date (typically 28-60 days after the charge) then you will not be charged any interest while building credit. Here's a quick overview of how a…

> Plenty of ways to get a credit card without credit history (secured credit cards are typically easiest) and as long as you pay it off before the statement due date

How it works? What the reason for a bank to give credit without interest? I just do not believe it. System must have a way to get interest. If system says it charges no interest, it means that interest payments are hidden. Either behind transactions fees, or by fixed costs covering maintanance of credit card, or by some other ways.

Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#150

Post by rosser »

mruts wrote: post #113
godelski wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> what if you need a car for/to reach work? This is America. So the answer is almost certainly: "Yes, you need your car to reach work."

5% of Americans take public transit to get to work. I wouldn't call that an almost certainty that you need a car. An almost certainty would be maybe under <.001%

How many of that 5% live in places where public transit is even a meaningful option for them to get to work?

How much of the country is that, again?

What's that ratio in the places where it isn't?

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