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Working for a startup makes less sense, unless you are into the mission

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Re: Working for a startup makes less sense, unless you are into the mission

#91

Post by icedchai »

crazygringo wrote: post #17
rubicon33 wrote: post #12

> That startup sold for 200 million dollars and, as the 10th engineer, I made ... 15000 dollars from that exit. Why so low?

Yeah, that's 0.0075%. Versus a ballpark of a 10th engineer getting, say, 0.5%. Even a few rounds of dilution can't explain a drop of two orders of magnitude. I'm thinking the author either didn't pay attention or care or trusted too much in the initial offer, didn't stay long enough to vest most of it, didn't buy most of their options in the end, or all of the above?

Dilution isn't all that matters. There's also investor liquidation preferences that can drastically change the outcome.

Re: Working for a startup makes less sense, unless you are into the mission

#93

Post by misthop »

rubicon33 wrote: post #12

> That startup sold for 200 million dollars and, as the 10th engineer, I made ... 15000 dollars from that exit. Why so low?

I'm guessing a bad options grant.

I worked for a bootstrapped company that had some minimal investment and equity. Company sold for ~$12Mil and I pocketed 80K, on top of a market salary

Re: Working for a startup makes less sense, unless you are into the mission

#95

Post by CalChris »

If you are going to look a startup as an investment, then you have to evaluate a startup as would a VC. If you are going to look at a startup as a place to learn skills and develop a network, that's another matter. Rarely will these two views coincide.

I still have friends from my first startup. I had lunch with a couple of them last week. I took that job on slightly more than a whim. I learned a ton and got to know some good people. I did some interesting work. In fact, at the time, I didn't even know how to evaluate a startup as VC might. So add that to the skills you might learn from a first startup.

As for the article, I disagree. I think there are a lot of crap startups, lifestyle startups, that you should avoid. However, I personally still believe but you have to be brutal in your selection, as a VC would be.

Re: Working for a startup makes less sense, unless you are into the mission

#96

Post by birken »

save_ferris wrote: post #61
birken wrote: post #53

One thing that gets glossed over a lot with startups is that often times the technical skill level is really low. If you are a young engineer and you are hoping to learn technical skills, be very very careful about which startup you join because you might end up at one where nobody actually has any idea what they are doing. And if you yourself are in the learning phase of your career, you might not have the experienc…

> At least one very important benefit of joining a big, reputable company is that the technical skill level will be good I don't believe this is a universal truth, especially since your experience at a large company is largely dictated by the specific team you work on. I've definitely worked for small startups that were far more talented than some of the technical teams I've worked on at big companies.

Well nothing is a universal truth, but I think my point is generally accurate.

IMO a bad team at a good company is way way better than a "good" team at a bad startup where nobody knows what they are doing. At the very least the company will have lots of resources outside of your team to learn from (company-wide infrastructure and processes, tech talks, etc).

I also am not saying all startups are bad, and in fact I know that many startups are full of very talented people who are certainly more talented than the average person at a big company. And it is possible, and maybe even likely, that a good team at a good startup is better learning environment than a good team at a big company.

But I think the median team at a big company has a pretty good technical level, and the median team at a small startup (for example one that is just graduating from YC) is fairly bad. If you are young engineer who doesn't know any better, you are much much safer taking a job at a big company if learning about good engineering is your chief priority.

Re: Working for a startup makes less sense, unless you are into the mission

#97

Post by angryasian »

I've worked everywhere from small startups, to big FAANG companies and big enterprise companies. I am in the very same opinion as op.

1. Financially the exits weren't worth it. The amount you actually learn is incredibly questionable.

2. Working at bigger companies I learned a hell of a lot more, from the mere fact that there are a bigger pool of resources with a lot of experience to go get help from. This is just not technology, but even from improving management and soft skills. You'll learn a hell of a lot more on your career path moving up to Director and VP level from a big company than the equivalent title at a startup.

3. Everything else is really dependent on you as an individual. I personally thrived at a big company. As the writer suggested at a startup its all about shipping and things are pretty much laid out for you. At a big company, it really gives you time to take advantage of resources and people .. you just have to be very aggressive and pro active in your pursuits.

Re: Working for a startup makes less sense, unless you are into the mission

#98

Post by alexcnwy »

acconrad wrote: post #21

As someone who was a 1st engineer of a startup that successfully exited I had what would be considered a good payout. When looking over the course of my career, however, it simply made up for the reduced salary I took for the years I worked there. It was a net-neutral outcome to be the 1st engineer at a startup that actually exited for a substantial (8-figure deal) outcome which already puts me in the minority. So no…

experience earned IS a financial investment because it increases your future earning power.

whether the increase in the expected present value of your future earnings justifies the present-day lower salary is a question of magnitudes and probabilities

Re: Working for a startup makes less sense, unless you are into the mission

#99

Post by prepend »

Has it ever? I’ve worked for a bunch of unsuccessful startups and it never “made sense” to work for them. I loved it and learned a lot and still was able to meet Maslow’s hierarchy.

But it seems like an odd message since working for startups is pretty much never the sensible thing to do.

Re: Working for a startup makes less sense, unless you are into the mission

#100

Post by auggierose »

bargl wrote: post #6

> In my experience, the deadline-driven culture crushes any scope for creativity and experimentation. This is true anywhere. It's amplified in a startup because you can't switch teams or move around to get on an innovation driven team, it will also have a much bigger affect. If you only focus on deadlines, developers (by necessity) start taking short cuts and laying code that pushes boundaries less. If they get punis…

I think it is in the nature of risk that you get punished if you end up on the losing side of it, no?
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