Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads” • Hacker News Board

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#261

Post by mattmillr » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:27 PM UTC

criddell wrote: post #240

sercand wrote: post #20

When you receive that email from Google you can only fill a generic form given at the bottom of the email. You can't contact a human being to understand why it is rejected/removed. Problem is not written clearly and it doesn't include a screenshot as apple does. Google is terrible at support on Play Store (and some more of its services).

I understand that Google wants to handle as much as possible with a support.py script, but they really should start having people to contact. Maybe there should be a fee for a support request and if the Google rep finds that Google's automated system messed up they report the problem internally and refund the fee to the app developer.

I'm not confident a fee structure that incentivizes Google to not be wrong will work that well.

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#262

Post by merpnderp » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:33 PM UTC

dTal wrote: post #256

shawnz wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bubbling (something Google does intentionally to make the user experience better) is a much different and much less serious problem than the fact that Google offers inadequate customer support and has a heavy-handed banning policy

I'm not convinced it's less serious. Google's bad behaviour is serious precisely because it has total control of the memetic environment. I've never had a problem with Google that would have required customer support, but I am conscious that I make dozens of Google searches a day, and that my view of the web is exactly what Google wants my view of the web to be. That scares me more than the customer service I've neve…

Use DuckDuckGo.

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#263

Post by dTal » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:36 PM UTC

anigionuio wrote: post #241

Why is it that software repositories work so much better than these app stores? Every app store on every platform is a wasteland of adware and malware, but I have never found such a program in, say, the Debian repos. App stores manage to be simultaneously more restrictive than a repository and less trustworthy than downloading executables through a web browser.

There's an element of curation - any rando can't just upload something to Debian, there's a web of trust.

But mainly I think it's that repositories are invariably built from source. Everything in a distro repository is open source software, guranteed to have been built from source from scratch. F-Droid does this, and its repositories are as clean as any Linux distro's as far as I can tell.

(This is why Moxie's claim that F-Droid is somehow less secure than Google Play because it signs its own .apks is weapons-grade baloneyum. On Google Play, that .apk could have anything in it. On F-Droid, that signature is a guarantee that that app has been downloaded and built from public sources, just like any Linux distribution. If F-Droid allowed developers to sign their own apps, then F-Droid couldn't build the apps, unless every app supported reproducible builds.)

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#264

Post by whoopdedo » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:38 PM UTC

giancarlostoro wrote: post #195

thatoneuser wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Had similar experience. Several years ago app with 6+ digit installs in the first six months. Got some generic excuse and our app was down. We could contest but then they threatened to take even more away. I don't like these platforms...

What's sad is the apps that do need to be removed (ie asking for way more permissions) never do, and the ones just trying to get into the ecosystem get punished for automated incompetence. The cutesy act of Google is really getting old. I rather just do progressive web apps as they become more common and not worry about their crappy app store.

I would suspect that some of those apps are being removed. But they are cockroaches. Google can crush one of them but there are 100 more right behind it. The scammers response to automated moderation is automated submission.

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#265

Post by pavel_lishin » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:40 PM UTC

dmitryminkovsky wrote: post #212

pavel_lishin wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have a choice, the choices are just worse. I tried using DDG for a long time, but it's just _terrible_ for technical queries.

Not as good as google, but it still makes sense to make it (or something else) your default search engine for those 99% of times it actually works just fine.

But it doesn't work fine 99%. I tried to find a short story I read awhile ago, so I DDG'ed for "Berryman Parrot".

DDG helpfully suggests a bunch of unrelated videos - a Coldplay video, a Tyler, The Creator sketch from the Eric Andrew show, and something about a C-line fencing tool. The actual search results are vaguely related, since the first one is a youtube video about birds with someone named Berryman in the description. The next one is a bird rescue, and the third appears to be some sort of etsy shop.

Compare to Google. The first result is the Wikipedia entry for the exact story I was searching for. The second result is the full published story. The third is a related story set in the same universe. Google then shows me some image results, and bam, the second one is actually related to the short story!

Sorry, DDG. You just don't cut it for my needs.

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#266

Post by alohahacker » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:55 PM UTC

I had a similar situation where I contacted google and asked permission about having a certain app made. Got the green light from several google teams. Pushed and marketed the app and app brought in 7+ figures of revenue throughout the years. Got shut down after about 2 years randomly with no feedback etc. Even my personal consultants from google that they assign to you had no clue and I was left to fend for myself and just eat the lost/work I put into the app.

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#267

Post by wyldfire » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:55 PM UTC

balls187 wrote: post #81

ams6110 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No you can't sue them. Nobody has a right to publish apps on Google Play. They can be as arbitrary or incompetent as they like in what they do. As long as they aren't violating some protected class criteria, there's not much a court is going to do. Google hasn't taken away anything. There is still a web and you're free to deploy what you want there on your terms. (Edits to correct Google's autocorrect errors.)

(IANAL) You CAN sue them, but for what is unclear. "Wielding too much power" isn't a crime. And even if you could find a legitimate reason, you are unlikely to win. I would assume Google Play's Terms of Service has several clauses, including indemnity, arbitration, and agreement that Google can remove your app at anytime for any reason. Any of those should be sufficient to have the suit summarily dimissed.

> You CAN sue them, but for what is unclear. "Wielding too much power" isn't a crime.

Criminal statutes don't apply to an individual's remedy here. You can sue for damages, but, yes, "wielding power" is not evidence of damages.

However, the power being wielded could be evidence in an anti-trust suit brought by the government.

The Play Store does lots of interesting and innovative stuff in the space of automated tests to detect malware. But clearly there's a lot of room for improvement.

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#268

Post by tomohawk » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:57 PM UTC

quickthrower2 wrote: post #119

From the blog comments: > Good luck man. I had an app removed because someone did a review of it and their review had screenshots of my app and Google banned the app for copyright infringement siting them as the source. No appeal, one strike, never got through to a human. If true that’s laughablly insane.

Its absolutely the sane result you get with an unregulated monopoly.

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#269

Post by jabo » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:58 PM UTC

maxxxxx wrote: post #172

quickthrower2 wrote: post #119

From the blog comments: > Good luck man. I had an app removed because someone did a review of it and their review had screenshots of my app and Google banned the app for copyright infringement siting them as the source. No appeal, one strike, never got through to a human. If true that’s laughablly insane.

Seems this will be our future. A lot of systems will be massive, automated and do mostly the right thing. But to cut cost there will be no way to fix errors so if you get caught up in such a situation you are just sorry, out of luck.

This sounds like a good story line for an episode of BlackMirror.

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#270

Post by CharlesW » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:59 PM UTC

trazire wrote: post #258

skykooler wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It already costs $100 to be able to upload an app to Apple's App Store - I feel like that sort of support should be included in that price.

$100/year to upload unlimited apps.

Also, iOS developers can reach people at Apple.