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Twitter forces all new users to enter a valid phone number

sucky.ninja

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Re: Twitter forces all new users to enter a valid phone number

#221

Post by baroffoos »

packet_nerd wrote: post #199
baroffoos wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There isn't any good way to maintain perfect privacy while also rejecting bots/trolls with 20 accounts.

Here's an idea that I thought of.. Suppose WebAuthn was the standard authentication scheme everywhere. People used a series of tokens (Yubikeys, phone apps, etc.) with private keys which they use to authenticate to services. The government runs a department where you present them proof of your identity and the public keys from your Yubikeys/whatever, and they would publish a cryptographically signed electronic messag…

This still doesn't allow for the case where you have multiple accounts for valid reasons like keeping personal and professional accounts but neither does a phone number so this is still an improvement.

I think the main thing blocking this is its a huge pain to go through this system when the average person doesn't care that facebook and twitter have their phone number

Re: Twitter forces all new users to enter a valid phone number

#222

Post by dymk »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #125
bilbo0s wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe I don't? Because that's what I thought you meant. I thought you meant Twitter is trying to put the squeeze on the spammers and propaganda ministers because they will lose advertisers if they can't? Did you mean something else?

Did you read the link to the EFF page I added to the post? Why should Twitter be considered any more trustworthy than Facebook when they ask me for something they don't need to know? They can avoid being victimized by spam and propaganda some other way... preferably some other way that I couldn't trivially defeat by giving them the number of a throwaway SIM card or a public phone booth.

How else would you suggest they combat spam? How do you receive a verification SMS on a public phone booth?

Most actual humans have a phone number, and Twitter wants a semi-1:1 mapping between human and Twitter account. Spammers have hundreds. This seems like a reasonable way to greatly increase the cost of making accounts for spammers.

Re: Twitter forces all new users to enter a valid phone number

#223

Post by freeflight »

banana_giraffe wrote: post #43

The article states and asks: > I had a new IP > I had a newly installed operating system and browser. > What exactly about my behavior is unusual? It's not that this behavior is unusual (though, it is), it's that this behavior looks exactly like a bot. It's sad, but this is the state of the world now. If you're a big actor like Twitter, you end up blocking anything that looks like a bot, with an escape hatch a user c…

It is kind of weird to consider not having a static IP as "suspicious" as dynamic IPs are the de-facto standard with most ISPs in my country, you actually have to pay extra if you want a static IP.

Re: Twitter forces all new users to enter a valid phone number

#224

Post by dymk »

Nextgrid wrote: post #83
etaioinshrdlu wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can I have 100 phone numbers for free? I don't believe it is so easy.

The same way we have the robocall situation (thanks to shady telcos that turn a blind eye), the same way this system will be bypassed with similar telcos offering massive blocks of numbers at very cheap prices per unit (Twilio numbers seem expensive at small scale, but I guarantee you will get those prices down if you commit to getting like a thousand of those or so at once).

What you're saying is, this has increased the cost of creating a Twitter spam account from practically zero cents to... what, 50 cents an number? A few dollars per number?

That's a huge leap, and it sounds like requiring a phone number is a great way to increase the cost of spamming.

Re: Twitter forces all new users to enter a valid phone number

#225

Post by caymanjim »

duluca wrote: post #162

A lot of people on here seem to be concerned about hiding their identity. Why? I don't understand. If you don't want to stand behind your statements you're part of the problem. Thus you shouldn't be part of the Twitter troll squad that creates unnecessary BS around movies and political events. Grow a pair and join the convo as your real self.

I know this is an unpopular opinion, especially on HN, but it's my stance as well. I can list a dozen reasons why anonymity is desirable, but I honestly don't care. I prefer to interact with people who own what they say. It keeps the conversation far more civil. The more anonymity a forum allows, the more vitriolic the discourse. I'd prefer to interact with adults. Anonymity is a recent curse and it absolutely does not aid democracy. It doesn't even aid free speech. It enables trolls, bots, and hatemongers to drown out average people.

Downvote away.

Re: Twitter forces all new users to enter a valid phone number

#227

Post by etaioinshrdlu »

dymk wrote: post #224
Nextgrid wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same way we have the robocall situation (thanks to shady telcos that turn a blind eye), the same way this system will be bypassed with similar telcos offering massive blocks of numbers at very cheap prices per unit (Twilio numbers seem expensive at small scale, but I guarantee you will get those prices down if you commit to getting like a thousand of those or so at once).

What you're saying is, this has increased the cost of creating a Twitter spam account from practically zero cents to... what, 50 cents an number? A few dollars per number? That's a huge leap, and it sounds like requiring a phone number is a great way to increase the cost of spamming.

Especially considering your average user already has a phone number and its basically free to verify. It only has a cost for spammers.

Re: Twitter forces all new users to enter a valid phone number

#228

Post by Kbye »

Here is my advice. NEVER EVER take advice from Indian managers. Almost all are terrible and have zero personality whatsoever. Almost all hire their own kind. South Indians are expert with this mindset (long and ugly names) Indians have obsequious mindset and are driven by jealousy, envy, and resentment.

I know this comment won't last long or is not framed to be politically correct. But, that's the truth. There are good Indian managers, but those are far and few within.

Don't believe me? Look at any online forum and see comments posted.

This site features two Indian managers. 9 out 10 chance both are terrible.

Also, if you want to work for woman managers, work for ones above 45-50 at least. They are more mature and won't jeopardize your career. Asian woman managers (Indians too) are big no-no.

You are welcome!

Re: Twitter forces all new users to enter a valid phone number

#229

Post by freeflight »

Pfhreak wrote: post #10
burtonator wrote: post #6

This is the new norm... expect all services to require phone numbers due to spam and propaganda.

I have a really split opinion about this. On the one hand I've seen a lot of really hateful stuff lobbed around on sites like Twitter, and I suspect that linking accounts to phone numbers would dramatically reduce that. On the other hand, I'm not sure I want Twitter (et. al.) knowing my phone number.

I think that at this point FB has proven that people will be nasty regardless of how not-anonymous they are.

As such I'm doubtful this will change anything about peoples behavior.

It's also quite scary how nonchalant many people here are arguing for this to stop "propaganda" which these days seems to be as easily defined as "Anything that doesn't conform with a Western/US-centric narrative".

Because I have yet to see one of these "propaganda ban waves" be reasoned with anything but "Russia/Iranian/Chinese propaganda" like that's the only kind of "propaganda" that exists [0].

As such I consider these "propaganda bans" just another exercise in propaganda [1].

[0] https://washingtonsblog.com/2014/07/pentagon-admits-spending...

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falsehood_in_War-Time#Summary

Re: Twitter forces all new users to enter a valid phone number

#230

Post by Carpetsmoker »

packet_nerd wrote: post #208
Carpetsmoker wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a prepaid account, which is basically free after the initial investment, which is usually just a few €/$/£/etc. If you're careful enough it can also be reasonably anonymous.

> reasonably anonymous The signup process has always been quite invasive for me. Is it possible get a phone in the states without handing over your SS, name, and DoB? I've never tried; what happens if you give bogus info?

I don't know about the United States as I've not been, but in every other country I've gotten a SIM it's been a matter of picking it up and the store and handing over money, same as if you're buying, say, deodrant. You can top up money anonymously too by buying prepaid vouchers.

I've certainly never had to hand over stuff like social security number (wtf?), but perhaps laws and/or telcos are different in U.S.

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