Credder Wants to Create an Equivalent to “Rotten Tomatoes” for News • Hacker News Board

Re: Credder Wants to Create an Equivalent to “Rotten Tomatoes” for News

#51

Post by ddebernardy » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 12:40 PM UTC

rjtavares wrote: post #9

keiferski wrote: post #4

Taking a look at the Rotten Tomatoes “Top 100 Films of All Time” list [1], I’m not exactly sure why it’s a model to be replicated. It’s extremely obvious that “top” means “popular and/or most advertised.” [1] https://www.rottentomatoes.com/top/bestofrt/

RT's model prioritizes consensus in quality instead of brilliance. Using RT for a best of list will give you good safe movies instead of outstanding ones. I'd say it's a good model for news.

If that's the yardstick, one could just as well open the NYT, the WP, the WSJ, or [your favorite reputable newspaper] and call it a day -- no RT clone needed.

Re: Credder Wants to Create an Equivalent to “Rotten Tomatoes” for News

#52

Post by ddebernardy » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 12:41 PM UTC

rjtavares wrote: post #17

cat199 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

... except that most of the news that actually matters is 'outstanding' rather than 'good and safe'

Actually, most of your news consumption should be of the 'good and safe' variety. That is an absolutely necessary requirement for you to properly evaluate 'oustanding and unsafe' news.

If I'm not mistaking, parent was meaning major investigative journalism efforts and high profile scoops, like the Snowden revelations, the Panama Papers, etc.

Re: Credder Wants to Create an Equivalent to “Rotten Tomatoes” for News

#53

Post by duwease » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 12:45 PM UTC

I want to bring a note of positivity here -- while most comments seem to be poking holes in the concept, all also seem to acknowledge the need for such a service to be successful.

This is a domain that I've also put a lot of thought into over the years, so I hope something succeeds. And some things do. Keep in mind that Wikipedia caught a lot of flak for being unreliable or impossible at first, but nowadays they have a robust editorial process for contentious subjects that I'd consider the gold standard for any such practical applications on the internet.

Re: Credder Wants to Create an Equivalent to “Rotten Tomatoes” for News

#54

Post by dragonwriter » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 12:51 PM UTC

rjtavares wrote: post #9

keiferski wrote: post #4

Taking a look at the Rotten Tomatoes “Top 100 Films of All Time” list [1], I’m not exactly sure why it’s a model to be replicated. It’s extremely obvious that “top” means “popular and/or most advertised.” [1] https://www.rottentomatoes.com/top/bestofrt/

RT's model prioritizes consensus in quality instead of brilliance. Using RT for a best of list will give you good safe movies instead of outstanding ones. I'd say it's a good model for news.

> RT's model prioritizes consensus in quality instead of brilliance. Using RT for a best of list will give you good safe movies instead of outstanding ones.

> I'd say it's a good model for news.

It's not, but then the whole concept isn't good for news. Particularly, a model with the effects you describe would favor news that, irrespective of the ground facts, avoids reaching conclusions that are going to be unwelcome to any significant group.

Re: Credder Wants to Create an Equivalent to “Rotten Tomatoes” for News

#55

Post by conception » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 12:55 PM UTC

Izkata wrote: post #49

dmortin wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note that this list is based on the tomato score which doesn't directly refers to the movie quality, it simply says if the movie is worth seeing. There is also a rating which is usually hidden by default (click the more info link on a film's page). If you check that then you see, for example, that the number 1 Black Panther's rating is 8.26, while number 2 Lady Bird has a rating of 8.74, so it's a better rated movie.…

> Note that this list is based on the tomato score It's not, it even shows that score on the list. #1 is scored 97% while #2 is 99%. What would be better is a top list based on audience score, not critic score.

So IMDB?

Re: Credder Wants to Create an Equivalent to “Rotten Tomatoes” for News

#56

Post by rjtavares » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 12:56 PM UTC

ddebernardy wrote: post #52

rjtavares wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, most of your news consumption should be of the 'good and safe' variety. That is an absolutely necessary requirement for you to properly evaluate 'oustanding and unsafe' news.

If I'm not mistaking, parent was meaning major investigative journalism efforts and high profile scoops, like the Snowden revelations, the Panama Papers, etc.

I count those as "outstanding and unsafe" (as they happened).

Re: Credder Wants to Create an Equivalent to “Rotten Tomatoes” for News

#57

Post by goto11 » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 12:57 PM UTC

nukeop wrote: post #30

keiferski wrote: post #4

Taking a look at the Rotten Tomatoes “Top 100 Films of All Time” list [1], I’m not exactly sure why it’s a model to be replicated. It’s extremely obvious that “top” means “popular and/or most advertised.” [1] https://www.rottentomatoes.com/top/bestofrt/

RT has been a joke ever since they rated a Marvel movie as the greatest achievement of cinematography in history.

Rotten Tomatoes does not rate anything. They aggregate reviews.

Re: Credder Wants to Create an Equivalent to “Rotten Tomatoes” for News

#58

Post by josefresco » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 1:00 PM UTC

This, and many other concepts based on "vetting" news assumes that the audience cares. A significant portion of the audience does not care, and is instead looking for news that validates their worldview, and furthers their (and their chosen political party's) goals. So basically these services will cannibalize the part of the audience that does care about truth, turning people against each other over marginally skewed articles. Meanwhile, the other site is happy to share falsehoods, because it helps them ... win.

Re: Credder Wants to Create an Equivalent to “Rotten Tomatoes” for News

#59

Post by motogpjimbo » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 1:02 PM UTC

netsharc wrote: post #34

cat199 wrote: post #14

give the user control of the reputation ranking, and you might have something here..

But it will just leave the system vulnerable to brigading. That even happened on RT for the Captain Marvel movie because of the female heroine, many "snowflakes" got offended and gave a movie that wasn't even out yet bad ratings. Kinda funny how these snowflakes (let me assume white males) call out "SJW"s while meanwhile they themselves actually believe society is mistreating them and so in their rage they're also ex…

> That even happened on RT for the Captain Marvel movie because of the female heroine, many "snowflakes" got offended and gave a movie that wasn't even out yet bad ratings.

Alternatively, they were using the "Want to See" feature on Rotten Tomatoes exactly as it was intended to be used. People didn't like aspects of the marketing campaign for Captain Marvel and made their opinions known using a tool Rotten Tomatoes provided specifically for that purpose.

There are many female-led films listed on Rotten Tomatoes that have very high approval fan ratings. By dismissing the public reaction to Captain Marvel merely as trolling by snowflakes, you're actually proving the point many people on this thread are making about partisanship and tribalism in news reporting.

Re: Credder Wants to Create an Equivalent to “Rotten Tomatoes” for News

#60

Post by goto11 » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 1:05 PM UTC

keiferski wrote: post #4

Taking a look at the Rotten Tomatoes “Top 100 Films of All Time” list [1], I’m not exactly sure why it’s a model to be replicated. It’s extremely obvious that “top” means “popular and/or most advertised.” [1] https://www.rottentomatoes.com/top/bestofrt/

It is important to understand what RT actually are rating here. It is not an aggregate of reviewers selections of best movies ever. Neither is it some aggregate of how much reviewers liked a certain movie.

RT is more like a list of the movies which a lot of critics rated but fewest critics disliked. So you get popular and uncontroversial. These are good choices for movies to show on airplanes.

It is actually an interesting rating, as long as you understand what is being rated.