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Dell Autism Hiring Program

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Re: Dell Autism Hiring Program

#161

Post by Pharmakon »

gizmo686 wrote: post #160
soberhoff wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're saying you should get diagnosed as a form of legal protection in case you accidentally have a weird interaction with the other sex?

Not just legal. People are much more forgiving of innapropriatw behaviour if they can point to a disability outside of your control; as opposed to you just being a jerk. No one complain about a blind man staring at them if they know they are blind.

Not just legal. People are much more forgiving of innapropriatw behaviour if they can point to a disability outside of your control; as opposed to you just being a jerk. No one complain about a blind man staring at them if they know they are blind.

Because they are literally not seeing you. If someone pinches your ass, but has autism they still pinched your ass. If someone is so disabled that they assault or harass people, that is a problem that won’t necessarily be forgiven. Instead it might lead to claims that the person is so disabled they require a more structured environment.

...And of course if it turns out that you lied about your disability or its role in your behavior, everyone will want your head on a pike.

Re: Dell Autism Hiring Program

#162

Post by ThrustVectoring »

Sniffnoy wrote: post #74

Here's what I'm wondering: if they think this separate process is more reliable than traditional interviewing... why keep it a separate process rather than using it for everyone?

A process that corrects for biases against autistics - such as lack of eye contact - would be more accurate only for assessing autistics.

Re: Dell Autism Hiring Program

#163

Post by wolfgke »

itronitron wrote: post #137
black-tea wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not necessarily. Like anything it could be good or bad in certain situations. I interpret it as meaning the person will be driven to do what's right according to logic and merit as opposed to politics. It's another way of saying they are a disagreeable employee which are known to be very valuable to companies.

I also take it to mean that they will focus on what they enjoy and not scrabble to climb the corporate ladder.

> I also take it to mean that they will focus on what they enjoy and not scrabble to climb the corporate ladder.

Climbing the corporate ladder is something many employees seem to enjoy.

Re: Dell Autism Hiring Program

#164

Post by ThrustVectoring »

booleandilemma wrote: post #155
ziroshima wrote: post #142

Tangentially related, as someone who is almost certainly "on the spectrum", but has never been diagnosed, is there any benefit to having this diagnosis? Is there any point in seeing someone about it?

Is there an objective test for autism or is it just a matter of convincing an expert that you’re autistic? I’m asking because, if society provides enough benefits for people “on the spectrum” how do we prevent people from gaming the system? When benefits are involved at all, people act funny. I’m reminded of people misusing handicapped parking placards, for instance. I’ve also known people with perfect vision to wear…

Autism is a developmental disorder, so any case severe enough to need large amounts of social support will generally get diagnosed before people start trying to rig the system (Munchausen by Proxy cases excepted, of course). You can get an adult diagnosis of autism spectrum, and they'll ask about your childhood, but it's not currently worthwhile to verify via interviewing your parents.

Also, social security disability benefits for autism are difficult to obtain without a childhood diagnosis. Basically the thinking is that if you weren't disabled enough for your parents to need help getting you through school, you're not disabled enough to be unable to work. This really sucks for the edge cases that fall through the gap, but does have anti-fraud advantages.

Re: Dell Autism Hiring Program

#165

Post by 52-6F-62 »

zerr wrote: post #132
wrnr wrote: post #71

The way our industry treats neuro-diversity is autistic. I am very dyslexic, the other day I misspelled the word TAB as TAP when implementing an event listener in a codebase +100K lines. It took me half a day just to find this bug. At LastCo I heard the project manager and scrum master joke behind my back "we'll just have the autist with OCD do the programming" while referring to me. In their mind lacking a "theory o…

As a side note, did you consider switching to statically typed language with a good IDE?

This isn’t a bad suggestion. I make silly spelling mistakes all of the time. Especially if there are other things going on in the office.

When I have to work with large JavaScript codebases I always move for TypeScript for that very reason.

It won’t compile if I’ve done something like that and will happily shout the line at me that (paraphrased example):

   545: someArray.srt((a: number, b: number) => a-b) - ‘srt’ does not exist on type Array
Etc, etc.

And good integration with an editor or IDE will produce these errors without needing to run the compile step which saves a lot of time and frustration.

Re: Dell Autism Hiring Program

#166

Post by TheCoelacanth »

booleandilemma wrote: post #155
ziroshima wrote: post #142

Tangentially related, as someone who is almost certainly "on the spectrum", but has never been diagnosed, is there any benefit to having this diagnosis? Is there any point in seeing someone about it?

Is there an objective test for autism or is it just a matter of convincing an expert that you’re autistic? I’m asking because, if society provides enough benefits for people “on the spectrum” how do we prevent people from gaming the system? When benefits are involved at all, people act funny. I’m reminded of people misusing handicapped parking placards, for instance. I’ve also known people with perfect vision to wear…

Would this even be a benefit for someone without autism? It appears to just be an alternate interview process. Unless you are failing the standard interview for the specific reasons that the alternate process is designed to avoid, you would be better off with the less time consuming standard process.

Re: Dell Autism Hiring Program

#167

Post by mamcx »

booleandilemma wrote: post #155
ziroshima wrote: post #142

Tangentially related, as someone who is almost certainly "on the spectrum", but has never been diagnosed, is there any benefit to having this diagnosis? Is there any point in seeing someone about it?

Is there an objective test for autism or is it just a matter of convincing an expert that you’re autistic? I’m asking because, if society provides enough benefits for people “on the spectrum” how do we prevent people from gaming the system? When benefits are involved at all, people act funny. I’m reminded of people misusing handicapped parking placards, for instance. I’ve also known people with perfect vision to wear…

Exist some "light" autism (that maybe I have?) and CAPITAL Autism (that my twin have). The second? It impair life so hard is impossible to live without constant help.

The kind of autism most people talk, like the one that is so "good" that you could actually have a nice Job on Dell and others, maybe is hard to diagnose. That is the reason to say is a "spectrum"

But autism that is in the hard side of this spectrum? Is impossible to miss it.

Re: Dell Autism Hiring Program

#168

Post by sverhagen »

wastedhours wrote: post #77
sverhagen wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aren't you giving an interpretation that just isn't compatible with the literal meaning of disability? Doesn't it literally mean "unable"? That doesn't sound like a word you'd want to live up to. Maybe something like "challenged" would fit your definition better?

Nope, pretty much every official use of "disability" in an HR/official process is taken as the OP said.

Sure, but isn't that what offense is taken for? In the Netherlands there was a move to calling it "less abled" ("minder-valide") instead of "invalid" or "handicapped". It's just a softer way that seems more considerate of the non-binary effects of a condition.

Re: Dell Autism Hiring Program

#169

Post by DoreenMichele »

ziroshima wrote: post #142

Tangentially related, as someone who is almost certainly "on the spectrum", but has never been diagnosed, is there any benefit to having this diagnosis? Is there any point in seeing someone about it?

That depends on a lot of factors. My ex and both my sons likely qualify for some kind of ASD diagnosis. None has a formal diagnosis.

My ex joined the military, where wearing a uniform was a requirement. His job before that was at McDonald's, where wearing a uniform was a also requirement.

Most people bitch about uniforms, but some people like not having to think about what to wear to work and wearing a uniform fits current recommendations to allow a person with ASD to have a limited selection of duplicates and wear similar or identical outfits everyday so as to not aggravate sensory issues.

I don't expect my ex to ever get a diagnosis. The label would be stigmatizing (and I think he would object to being so labeled) and he found his niche without needing a label.

My sons were never formally diagnosed in part because I began homeschooling them at an early age, when they were both in elementary school. I didn't need a formal diagnosis to accommodate their needs as a homeschooling parent. I just did the research and made the call as to what made sense.

If you can find a path forward that lets you do what makes sense for you without being diagnosed, that can absolutely work. If you want to do a particular thing and your quirks are interfering with that goal, I formal diagnosis may legally entitle you to appropriate accommodation.

Picking a job that happens to fit well with what works for you is one option.

Doing freelance work or running your own business so you get to have a lot of say in how things get done is another potential option.

Working for a small organization instead of a big one may give you more latitude to do what makes sense for you without needing a label and "a doctor's note," so to speak, to justify it.

Re: Dell Autism Hiring Program

#170

Post by ghufran_syed »

wrnr wrote: post #71

The way our industry treats neuro-diversity is autistic. I am very dyslexic, the other day I misspelled the word TAB as TAP when implementing an event listener in a codebase +100K lines. It took me half a day just to find this bug. At LastCo I heard the project manager and scrum master joke behind my back "we'll just have the autist with OCD do the programming" while referring to me. In their mind lacking a "theory o…

Is this necessarily a negative comment? It comes across to me as “we’ll get the person who’s really good at focusing to do the programming”. Unless it was said in a sarcastic way? I think it’s worth asking the person what they meant, if they meant it in a good way, you’ll find out, and if they meant it in a bad way, most people will be embarrassed about being asked about it, so it will put them on notice to avoid saying things like that in future.
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