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Google Stadia uses Style Transfer ML to change video game art in real time

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Re: Google Stadia uses Style Transfer ML to change video game art in real time

#51

Post by pducks32 »

lwb wrote: post #3

To me this was the least interesting part of the Stadia reveal. State share was the real innovation imo. Would any serious game studio use style transfer ml to actually replace their visual artists? Didn't seem like the quality was there. That said, it is an awesome PoC. Just not something I see being practically applicable.

One incredible use is actually in network training for things like AR and autonomous driving. You want a slightly fake world and you could easily try out various network approaches using a free fake world found in game engines. Microsoft has something for this but cannot find a link or the name right now.

Re: Google Stadia uses Style Transfer ML to change video game art in real time

#53

Post by kllrnohj »

mikewhy wrote: post #45
kllrnohj wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Maybe because I have a friend working on a video game as a solo developer, and putting a /lot/ of energy/money/time into art--I really see the potential in this (type of thing). For that usage Nvidia's thing was way more interesting: https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2019/03/18/gaugan-photorealist... That gets you usable texture assets super quickly, which is probably what your solo developer friend spends the most tim…

> For that usage Nvidia's thing was way more interesting If you're building a photorealistic game. And there's already lots of tools on the market to generate these sorts of textures. I could see this Nvidia thing used for much better looking mockups / concept art. But it doesn't seem suited for final asset generation.

> But it doesn't seem suited for final asset generation.

Well yes, of course, and neither is Google's Style Transfer ML. These are both just prototyping tools, not a magic wand to make production-quality assets.

Re: Google Stadia uses Style Transfer ML to change video game art in real time

#54

Post by tenaciousDaniel »

tanilama wrote: post #46
lwb wrote: post #3

To me this was the least interesting part of the Stadia reveal. State share was the real innovation imo. Would any serious game studio use style transfer ml to actually replace their visual artists? Didn't seem like the quality was there. That said, it is an awesome PoC. Just not something I see being practically applicable.

Exactly...This is a cool gimmick to try once, but it will seriously distort the intended art style. It is another example of forced intrusion of DL techniques creeping into places where it is not needed in the first place.

Gimmick is the perfect way to describe it. I really don't understand why they even included it.

Re: Google Stadia uses Style Transfer ML to change video game art in real time

#55

Post by robotmay »

chatmasta wrote: post #49
robotmay wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's pretty much a certainty with this project, in my opinion. Until everybody somehow has gigabit lines to their home and to their phones, I don't see this becoming popular. Like most Google projects, their actual success period is most likely 10+ years away, and the project will be axed long before then.

5G deployments have already started rolling out. 5G has average latency in the range of 1-2ms. Google controls a huge swath of the backbone after that. They can realistically achieve IMO, a more valid argument against its success would be that any consumer who is in a position to ensure they have fast enough internet for this service, is also in a position to buy a gaming console. But the counterargument to that is t…

Seeing as I live just on the outskirts of a capital city (Cardiff), and I can't even get 3G signal inside my house, and no more than 80/20 broadband; I'll remain skeptical about the possibility of success for this outside of very specific cities. There's also a lot to be said for reliability and the requirement to always have a fast connection: one of the benefits to many videogames is the fact that they are not online.

Isn't 5G on a wavelength that has poorer penetration than 4G? It might work in the USA but signal is a constant issue in stone housing here in the UK (though it may be better where you are based). I had to get a femtocell from EE in order to get signal in my house :\

Re: Google Stadia uses Style Transfer ML to change video game art in real time

#56

Post by disease »

dragonwriter wrote: post #17
lwb wrote: post #3

To me this was the least interesting part of the Stadia reveal. State share was the real innovation imo. Would any serious game studio use style transfer ml to actually replace their visual artists? Didn't seem like the quality was there. That said, it is an awesome PoC. Just not something I see being practically applicable.

> Would any serious game studio use style transfer ml to actually replace their visual artists? No, a serious (AAA) studio would not. OTOH, the platform might intend to support producers that aren't AAA studios, and whose limited pre-release resources are focussed on gameplay more than art assets, and those producers might view it very differently than AAA studios.

Any technology that can automatically perform the tedious task of coloring 2D art would be a godsend to indie game devs as well as amateur artists.

Re: Google Stadia uses Style Transfer ML to change video game art in real time

#57

Post by make3 »

currymj wrote: post #50

this is certainly just a neat gimmick, but it's interesting to me for a particular reason: the Stadia box uses an AMD GPU, and per the Google announcement, all the style transfer is done in real time. this suggests that we may soon have better AMD support in TensorFlow.

Tensorflow support on AMD is supposedly not awful anymore. https://medium.com/tensorflow/amd-rocm-gpu-support-for-tenso...

I wish someone who had >actualIt's an important question.

Re: Google Stadia uses Style Transfer ML to change video game art in real time

#58

Post by robdachshund »

smaili wrote: post #30

Is anyone else concerned this will be yet another Google product that goes by the wayside in a few years? This has essentially become my biggest fear now with any new product they announce/release.

I doubt this is going anywhere. As a PC gamer I have no need for this, don't want to deal with lag, and don't trust Google to operate the platform in a consumer friendly way.

Look at how angry people are at epic right now. Taking a brand that already has a bad rap and trying to start a new market (that has already failed several times over) is not a great angle, especially with an audience as skeptical and anal retentive as gamers.

Additionally, who is the audience for this? Casual gamers use consoles, and those more invested use PCs. This is too out of the box for the former and completely useless to the latter. I could also see Google trying to get exclusives which would be a PR disaster.

Sure, it's a novel idea and looks like a decent execution, but its by no means a new one. Onlive did this 10 years ago and couldn't get market share. PSnow is available right now and its completely unusable even with a great connection because they dont have enough servers. The game selection is also terrible considering they should be able to load up any game in their ecosystem. I cant play MGS4, the PS4 remaster of last of us, nor horizon as they want me to buy a console to play it. So what's the point?

Re: Google Stadia uses Style Transfer ML to change video game art in real time

#59

Post by currymj »

make3 wrote: post #57
currymj wrote: post #50

this is certainly just a neat gimmick, but it's interesting to me for a particular reason: the Stadia box uses an AMD GPU, and per the Google announcement, all the style transfer is done in real time. this suggests that we may soon have better AMD support in TensorFlow.

Tensorflow support on AMD is supposedly not awful anymore. https://medium.com/tensorflow/amd-rocm-gpu-support-for-tenso... I wish someone who had >actual It's an important question.

I haven't personally tried to do anything on an AMD GPU, but AMD actually has a very active GitHub repository https://github.com/ROCmSoftwarePlatform/tensorflow-upstream .

If you go through the issues you can get a sense of what it's like from people who do have practical experience.

Re: Google Stadia uses Style Transfer ML to change video game art in real time

#60

Post by Sephr »

currymj wrote: post #50

this is certainly just a neat gimmick, but it's interesting to me for a particular reason: the Stadia box uses an AMD GPU, and per the Google announcement, all the style transfer is done in real time. this suggests that we may soon have better AMD support in TensorFlow.

Style transfer is most likely not running on the GPU in this case. It's probably running on Google TPUs, given that the GPUs are likely already under high load in order to play AAA games at 4K HDR 60fps.
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