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Norsk Hydro ASA Suffers Extensive Cyber Attack

bloomberg.com

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Re: Norsk Hydro ASA Suffers Extensive Cyber Attack

#21

Post by bdamm »

magduf wrote: post #14
chrischen wrote: post #3

They should make it illegal to pay ransoms.

Were the affected systems running Windows? They should make it illegal to run critical systems on Windows.

Aside from being outdated advice, this is also globally impossible.

Microsoft Windows has got a major lock on the industrial control systems industry. Almost anything being produced today has a Windows machine in the workflow doing something critically important, from monitoring fluid flows to running microchip programmers and test stations.

Re: Norsk Hydro ASA Suffers Extensive Cyber Attack

#22

Post by lb1lf »

runarb wrote: post #16
pjc50 wrote: post #6

Aluminium plants are particularly vulnerable because the electrolysis "pots" must be kept hot, requiring a continuous supply of electricity. Supply interruptions can be a disaster. This has hit Venezuela badly: https://twitter.com/AKurmanaev/status/1104141813936545793 "Today Venezuela basically crossed off an entire industry. In one day. No more industrial aluminum production. Just like that. It’s gone." https://www.…

Thankfully the smelting can apparently be controlled manually. According to this article[0] all Hydro plants are still running 24/7, but now using paper, pencils, and calculators. 0: (In norwegian) https://e24.no/boers-og-finans/norsk-hydro/dataangrepet-lamm...

-An unsurprising, but somewhat amusing tidbit from the article is that Hydro's senior employees got a chance to shine today - while younger employees had only ever operated the plant via SCADA systems taken offline today, the staff closer to retirement ran the show like it was 1975.

A diverse workforce can be a bonus when things go pear-shaped; with any luck Hydro (and others!) take the lesson to heart and train all staff in fallback measures as part of their disaster planning.

Re: Norsk Hydro ASA Suffers Extensive Cyber Attack

#24

Post by michaelt »

onetimemanytime wrote: post #4
chrischen wrote: post #3

They should make it illegal to pay ransoms.

They'll find a way. Pay for consulting, pay from personal funds etc etc. Companies need to go back to work ASAP, ransom is a small cost of doing business.

Wouldn't the attackers inevitably blackmail you with the fact you illegally paid them?

Re: Norsk Hydro ASA Suffers Extensive Cyber Attack

#26

Post by Scoundreller »

lozaning wrote: post #17
onetimemanytime wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They'll find a way. Pay for consulting, pay from personal funds etc etc. Companies need to go back to work ASAP, ransom is a small cost of doing business.

I cant find the story anymore, but I seem to recall that at peak crypto locker there was a 'consulting company' that would fix this for you without you having to pay the attackers. Instead you paid the consultants double the extorted amount, and then they paid on your behalf.

Sounds like the usual methods to get around public sector limitations on employee pay.

Re: Norsk Hydro ASA Suffers Extensive Cyber Attack

#27

Post by michaelt »

magduf wrote: post #14
chrischen wrote: post #3

They should make it illegal to pay ransoms.

Were the affected systems running Windows? They should make it illegal to run critical systems on Windows.

Even if a power plant's control systems are airgapped, if you can knock out payroll they'll be in a pretty bad place :)

Re: Norsk Hydro ASA Suffers Extensive Cyber Attack

#29

Post by quakeguy »

lb1lf wrote: post #22
runarb wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thankfully the smelting can apparently be controlled manually. According to this article[0] all Hydro plants are still running 24/7, but now using paper, pencils, and calculators. 0: (In norwegian) https://e24.no/boers-og-finans/norsk-hydro/dataangrepet-lamm...

-An unsurprising, but somewhat amusing tidbit from the article is that Hydro's senior employees got a chance to shine today - while younger employees had only ever operated the plant via SCADA systems taken offline today, the staff closer to retirement ran the show like it was 1975. A diverse workforce can be a bonus when things go pear-shaped; with any luck Hydro (and others!) take the lesson to heart and train all…

Im glad to hear that. Hoping the younger staff will learn from the seniors, how to control the foundry and infrastructure. Thumbs up!

Re: Norsk Hydro ASA Suffers Extensive Cyber Attack

#30

Post by magduf »

bdamm wrote: post #21
magduf wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Were the affected systems running Windows? They should make it illegal to run critical systems on Windows.

Aside from being outdated advice, this is also globally impossible. Microsoft Windows has got a major lock on the industrial control systems industry. Almost anything being produced today has a Windows machine in the workflow doing something critically important, from monitoring fluid flows to running microchip programmers and test stations.

Then people shouldn't be too surprised when stuff like this happens, and they should just pay the ransom: it's what they accepted by using Windows.

"That's the way it's always been" isn't a valid excuse for continuing to make something unsafe.

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