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Nvidia's $99 Jetson Nano Is an AI Computer for DIY Enthusiasts

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Re: Nvidia's $99 Jetson Nano Is an AI Computer for DIY Enthusiasts

#101

Post by dmos62 »

amelius wrote: post #97
supernova87a wrote: post #76

I am continually amazed that we're able to buy better and cheaper processors that no one could have dreamed about at such power/cost 50 years ago. I estimate it would take me and you maybe 1 year to learn how to build / assemble most things you find in your house that cost $1000 in a store -- a couch, a rug, even a simple kitchen appliance (the dumb kind). But a CPU / computer? I could not invent that given 10,000 ye…

And audiophile-quality HiFi hasn't dropped in price a bit ...

Depends which component, maybe speakers or headphones, but there seem to be top-quality open-source DACs that are very cheap to assemble or buy assembled. A google search should turn them up.

Last time I researched it, I found the headphone DAC that I'd buy if I wanted one, but I can't find it now. It had an interesting story around it. It was released anonymously in a blog and then suddenly, after posting dozens of posts per year, the author just dropped off the grid. No one knows what happened to him. When one of the parts went out of production, others made modifications and rehosted the source, even though the original author did not want derivative works, but that kind of gets voided when the original author is, for all intents and purposes, not on this planet anymore.

Re: Nvidia's $99 Jetson Nano Is an AI Computer for DIY Enthusiasts

#102

Post by dmos62 »

FreedomToCreate wrote: post #2

Now I just need something to DIY with it. Any ideas?

Voice-controlled toilet, or toilet paper hanger, or toilet perfumerie; voice-controlled potted plant watering; voice-controlled head scratcher; voice-controlled backrub chair; voice-controlled pet feeder; I'm sorry, I'm just making fun of voice-control frivolities; voice-control voice-control-diy-ideas-generator.

Re: Nvidia's $99 Jetson Nano Is an AI Computer for DIY Enthusiasts

#103

Post by null000 »

supernova87a wrote: post #76

I am continually amazed that we're able to buy better and cheaper processors that no one could have dreamed about at such power/cost 50 years ago. I estimate it would take me and you maybe 1 year to learn how to build / assemble most things you find in your house that cost $1000 in a store -- a couch, a rug, even a simple kitchen appliance (the dumb kind). But a CPU / computer? I could not invent that given 10,000 ye…

I recognize and respect the point, but there's a pretty major differences: Raw material cost, automate-ability, and scale.

We have processes to get super pure silicon in huge chunks that can be processed basically entirely by computers and robots there on out (and in fat people touching it would be actively bad). Yeah, sure, there's a huge upfront cost in terms of machines to handle and etch the silicon and so on, but you get to amortize it over milllions and millions of units - a new fab was not created for the Jetson Nano.

Meanwhile, basically every appliance, furniture piece, etc both requires more expensive of raw materials, and requires a decent amount of human intervention and, especially for furniture, expertise during manufacturing, meaning that cost per unit doesn't scale as well as electronics. Not to mention they all sell in lower volumes per up-front skill person hour dedicated to that thing.

Re: Nvidia's $99 Jetson Nano Is an AI Computer for DIY Enthusiasts

#105

Post by akadruid1 »

doomjunky wrote: post #86
adrianN wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should read "From NAND to Tetris". You could totally build a CPU yourself after a year of study. Not something that can compete with a modern microprocessor of course, but then again you probably couldn't build a compressor for a fridge with the same quality as a factory either.

Look at this lead pencil. There's not a single person in the world who could make this pencil. [0] [0]: Milton Friedman https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5Gppi-O3a8

There's the guy who spent $1500 and six months making a sandwich from scratch[0], including growing, collecting and killing the ingredients

[0]: https://youtu.be/URvWSsAgtJE

Re: Nvidia's $99 Jetson Nano Is an AI Computer for DIY Enthusiasts

#106

Post by paulmd »

dmos62 wrote: post #101
amelius wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And audiophile-quality HiFi hasn't dropped in price a bit ...

Depends which component, maybe speakers or headphones, but there seem to be top-quality open-source DACs that are very cheap to assemble or buy assembled. A google search should turn them up. Last time I researched it, I found the headphone DAC that I'd buy if I wanted one, but I can't find it now. It had an interesting story around it. It was released anonymously in a blog and then suddenly, after posting dozens of…

That's NwAvGuy and the ODAC/O2 units.

I think "audiophile grade" is an ill-defined target there. You can get headphones like the Superlux HD668B for practically nothing (they were running under $30 at one point), and they sound pretty damned good for a pair of $30 headphones. When I was a kid you paid $30 for a pair of crappy discman headphones let alone a nice pair of over-ear. Meanwhile you've got the name brand Audio Technica and AKG sets running $100-200 thanks to moving production to China.

I kind of think people are under-selling just how cheap the "95% solutions" have become nowadays. The really exotic gear made in smaller runs and with meticulous quality control is still expensive, because that's inherently expensive to do, but the consumer-grade stuff has really moved up in quality and down in price.

At this point if you're paying thousands of dollars for audio gear, you're either chasing that last 5% of quality, or you're buying a name and a placebo effect, or both.

Re: Nvidia's $99 Jetson Nano Is an AI Computer for DIY Enthusiasts

#107

Post by cturner »

01100011 wrote: post #7

I wish these tiny SBCs came with SATA or m.2 so I could hook up an SSD. I know microSD is catching up, but it's not there yet.

The olimex olinuxinos have sata options, and some beagleboards. Also, look out for boards with eMMC options. That is a fairly fast onboard disk.

Re: Nvidia's $99 Jetson Nano Is an AI Computer for DIY Enthusiasts

#109

Post by agumonkey »

doomjunky wrote: post #86
adrianN wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should read "From NAND to Tetris". You could totally build a CPU yourself after a year of study. Not something that can compete with a modern microprocessor of course, but then again you probably couldn't build a compressor for a fridge with the same quality as a factory either.

Look at this lead pencil. There's not a single person in the world who could make this pencil. [0] [0]: Milton Friedman https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5Gppi-O3a8

Sorry to differ, I think this is twisted by an era where liberal market was held as god like status.

Take the rubber and metal out because for now. To draw a dark line on a surface, you take the first bit of wood you find, grind it into a point and burn it. You have a pencil.

I really believe that the free market centuries made people believe it was the only or most efficient way to get an object done, just like people thought java ee was the only way to make a web application in early 2000s.

Re: Nvidia's $99 Jetson Nano Is an AI Computer for DIY Enthusiasts

#110

Post by llampx »

lnsru wrote: post #95
djmips wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everyone's missing his point. Yes you could make a computer but an absolute toy compared to a Jetson. You could reasonably get close to the other technologies including a fridge compressor given a year of study. Your home built CPU isn't going to touch the Jetson.

We had a procesor design course at the university. Single participants made 68k complexity designs, groups went to 286 and more complex parts. It was 6-8 hours workload every week for 4 months. A year time is a lot! Manufacturing technology is another issue. Same design will deliver different results on 28 nm and 160 nm nodes.

What I wonder about is the 10x factor here - all of these designs have already been invented and are available for perusal. How many people could come up with something like this with nothing but a knowledge of mathematics?

I sometimes don't even know if I could invent the wheel if it wasn't already invented.

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