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To build the cities of the future, we must get out of our cars

nationalgeographic.com

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Re: To build the cities of the future, we must get out of our cars

#11

Post by RickJWagner »

mtberatwork wrote: post #9
Tepix wrote: post #2

Not exactly rocket science. Many cities around the world have figured it out already. To me it seems that the US went to the other extreme and is only slowly turning around. I remember reading "Das neue Universum"² in the early 80s where they proposed large skyscrapers connected by tubes. No cars in sight. Oh and don't miss "Das Neue Universum Volume 84 (1967)": http://klausbuergle.de/buergle_verkehr1.htm - Click on…

> the US went to the other extreme and is only slowly turning around. US car manufacturers are doubling down on large trucks and SUVs and the current administration continues to thwart progress on tackling climate change and other societal concerns. I would say the US, at least on a macro level, is still on the "other extreme" path.

I don't believe there is a nefarious scheme in play.

People who live in cities don't need cars.

People who live outside cities still need cars. The manufacturers try to fill that need. The manufacturers, sellers, etc. make the economy go 'round.

It will all change if/when economic forces bring it about. Directly forcing it through politics probably isn't the right approach.

Re: To build the cities of the future, we must get out of our cars

#13

Post by lr4444lr »

mtberatwork wrote: post #9
Tepix wrote: post #2

Not exactly rocket science. Many cities around the world have figured it out already. To me it seems that the US went to the other extreme and is only slowly turning around. I remember reading "Das neue Universum"² in the early 80s where they proposed large skyscrapers connected by tubes. No cars in sight. Oh and don't miss "Das Neue Universum Volume 84 (1967)": http://klausbuergle.de/buergle_verkehr1.htm - Click on…

> the US went to the other extreme and is only slowly turning around. US car manufacturers are doubling down on large trucks and SUVs and the current administration continues to thwart progress on tackling climate change and other societal concerns. I would say the US, at least on a macro level, is still on the "other extreme" path.

But those vehicles aren't necessarily being bought by urban consumers. Cities already have several disincentives toward large vehicle ownership.

Re: To build the cities of the future, we must get out of our cars

#14

Post by bogle »

RickJWagner wrote: post #11
mtberatwork wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the US went to the other extreme and is only slowly turning around. US car manufacturers are doubling down on large trucks and SUVs and the current administration continues to thwart progress on tackling climate change and other societal concerns. I would say the US, at least on a macro level, is still on the "other extreme" path.

I don't believe there is a nefarious scheme in play. People who live in cities don't need cars. People who live outside cities still need cars. The manufacturers try to fill that need. The manufacturers, sellers, etc. make the economy go 'round. It will all change if/when economic forces bring it about. Directly forcing it through politics probably isn't the right approach.

I don't think too many trust the market to make their decisions for them. The purpose of politics is to represent the people and, ideally, do what is best for them. That's definitely not what the market is for!

Get involved in politics if you want to bring about change in the world because companies whose job it is to sell more cars certainly aren't going to be helping improve the environment.

Re: To build the cities of the future, we must get out of our cars

#15

Post by bogle »

growtofill wrote: post #10

> they’d no longer segregate rich from poor Should people who want to spend more on housing be automatically labeled “rich”?

Should people who can't afford housing be automatically labelled "poor"? It's certainly one indicator.

Not segrating people improves the world. Segragating them introduces division, self-evidentially. Something to be avoided, then, and worked against.

Planners will try to mix properties in a new development, if the local politics is to provide for everyone fairly.

Re: To build the cities of the future, we must get out of our cars

#16

Post by ataturk »

mtberatwork wrote: post #9
Tepix wrote: post #2

Not exactly rocket science. Many cities around the world have figured it out already. To me it seems that the US went to the other extreme and is only slowly turning around. I remember reading "Das neue Universum"² in the early 80s where they proposed large skyscrapers connected by tubes. No cars in sight. Oh and don't miss "Das Neue Universum Volume 84 (1967)": http://klausbuergle.de/buergle_verkehr1.htm - Click on…

> the US went to the other extreme and is only slowly turning around. US car manufacturers are doubling down on large trucks and SUVs and the current administration continues to thwart progress on tackling climate change and other societal concerns. I would say the US, at least on a macro level, is still on the "other extreme" path.

[flagged]

Re: To build the cities of the future, we must get out of our cars

#17

Post by growtofill »

bogle wrote: post #15
growtofill wrote: post #10

> they’d no longer segregate rich from poor Should people who want to spend more on housing be automatically labeled “rich”?

Should people who can't afford housing be automatically labelled "poor"? It's certainly one indicator. Not segrating people improves the world. Segragating them introduces division, self-evidentially. Something to be avoided, then, and worked against. Planners will try to mix properties in a new development, if the local politics is to provide for everyone fairly.

I didn’t think about segregation on planning phase, thanks for the insight.

Answering your question: yes, I believe not being able to afford housing categorizes a person as poor.

“Provide everyone fairly” is a touchy subject and depends on how limited do you want your goverment to be. I’d rather choose where to live myself, based on my own means.

Re: To build the cities of the future, we must get out of our cars

#18

Post by gatherhunterer »

lr4444lr wrote: post #13
mtberatwork wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the US went to the other extreme and is only slowly turning around. US car manufacturers are doubling down on large trucks and SUVs and the current administration continues to thwart progress on tackling climate change and other societal concerns. I would say the US, at least on a macro level, is still on the "other extreme" path.

But those vehicles aren't necessarily being bought by urban consumers. Cities already have several disincentives toward large vehicle ownership.

Atlanta, Dallas, Houston, Phoenix, Las Vegas, Los Angeles and many more cities that are not New York or San Francisco are still filled with trucks and SUVs carrying no passengers and no cargo. Urban economies in the US are largely commuter-based and parking a large vehicle is not a problem for those who go back and forth between a driveway and a parking garage.

Re: To build the cities of the future, we must get out of our cars

#19

Post by ptero »

mtberatwork wrote: post #9
Tepix wrote: post #2

Not exactly rocket science. Many cities around the world have figured it out already. To me it seems that the US went to the other extreme and is only slowly turning around. I remember reading "Das neue Universum"² in the early 80s where they proposed large skyscrapers connected by tubes. No cars in sight. Oh and don't miss "Das Neue Universum Volume 84 (1967)": http://klausbuergle.de/buergle_verkehr1.htm - Click on…

> the US went to the other extreme and is only slowly turning around. US car manufacturers are doubling down on large trucks and SUVs and the current administration continues to thwart progress on tackling climate change and other societal concerns. I would say the US, at least on a macro level, is still on the "other extreme" path.

> US car manufacturers are doubling down on large trucks and SUVs

Manufacturers are building lots of SUVs because this is what people in the US prefer to buy. If manufacturers build tons of subcompacts instead they would have to drop prices and probably sell those subcompacts at a loss.

If you wanted to sell more small cars instead you should convince consumers to buy them (e.g., via end user incentives), which would make it profitable for car companies to build lots of them.

Re: To build the cities of the future, we must get out of our cars

#20

Post by [deleted] »

ptero wrote: post #19
mtberatwork wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the US went to the other extreme and is only slowly turning around. US car manufacturers are doubling down on large trucks and SUVs and the current administration continues to thwart progress on tackling climate change and other societal concerns. I would say the US, at least on a macro level, is still on the "other extreme" path.

> US car manufacturers are doubling down on large trucks and SUVs Manufacturers are building lots of SUVs because this is what people in the US prefer to buy. If manufacturers build tons of subcompacts instead they would have to drop prices and probably sell those subcompacts at a loss. If you wanted to sell more small cars instead you should convince consumers to buy them (e.g., via end user incentives), which would…

[deleted]
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