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Thinkpad X210

geoff.greer.fm

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Re: Thinkpad X210

#281

Post by hombre_fatal »

mbell wrote: post #271
hombre_fatal wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Activity Monitor itself also consumes a lot of CPU. And you tend to only use it when you've already suspected a problem, like when your fans start running. What's nice about having a global CPU graph is that you get used to normal idling levels and will start to notice anomalies. You're also just closer to the pulse of your computer. What exactly are normal bandwidth consumption levels over the course of a day? What…

> Activity Monitor itself also consumes a lot of CPU. And you tend to only use it when you've already suspected a problem, like when your fans start running. MacOS always tracks the energy usage stats so you don't have to keep activity monitor open, just look at the 'Average Energy Impact' column. iStats menu also uses a fair bit of CPU, similar to Activity Monitor, it's just split into a couple processes so it doesn…

My main point is that a global CPU graph helps you identify acute CPU consumption as it happens which is the main mechanism that helps me identify things like Spotify getting stuck in a spinlock or a browser tab devouring my battery. Seeing "Google Chrome" show up in Activity Monitor's energy chart when you check it periodically isn't as helpful.

Good point about iStat Menus consuming its own resources. It has two processes afaict with its main process staying below 1% CPU. I bet that number sees an increase once you start turning on more HUDs like the temp/fan sensors and jacking up the update frequency though.

Re: Thinkpad X210

#282

Post by Nihilartikel »

hopler wrote: post #98
ekianjo wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A standard form-factor means components would be re-usable between upgrades We don't even have to go that far. Just ensuring that laptops can be serviced by their own users would go a long way to reduce e-waste. i.e. not soldering RAM chips to the motherboard, making it feasible to remove every single part (not gluing the keyboard to the MB for example), etc... instead of pursuing an ever thinner laptop design, whi…

Consumers prefer super-thin soldered machines, sadly. The proof is in the shopping.

Consumers are multi modal, though. Many can't be bothered to dig in and debug or want a sleek highly integrated product. Some others care less for those things and want an upgradeable, repairable product. It's my hope that economic solutions will find the resources accommodate both modalities.

Re: Thinkpad X210

#283

Post by bubblethink »

mjg59 wrote: post #268
saagarjha wrote: post #6

> Battery life is a little over 4 hours with the flush battery (55Wh) and 6-7 hours with the extended battery (80Wh). Not going to lie, that’s pretty horrible. > Battery life would increase by 50% if I got PC6 or PC8 idle states. The fan only turns on if I’m doing something intensive like compiling go or scrolling in Slack. lol. One of the things that really drives me nuts is my computer’s fan turning on when I know…

>Not going to lie, that’s pretty horrible. The stock firmware is, uh, not good. I ported Coreboot to the second batch boards ( https://github.com/mjg59/coreboot/tree/X210_good ) and things improved significantly - I wrote it up at https://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/50924.html

Does it use the regular thinkpad EC, or is that also something custom ?

Re: Thinkpad X210

#284

Post by hakfoo »

ryacko wrote: post #202
alkonaut wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some parts such as batteries, storage, ram etc should at least be a standardized. Manufacturers probably don’t want to standardize on the remaining motherboard/graphics/chassis/cooling because a laptop isn’t like an atx computer where you get modularity at the expense of wasted space. A laptop is basically a 3D puzzle with thermal components. Few consumers would buy a laptop with even a little wasted volume or weight…

I just wish there was a portable all-in-one PC with modular components (since vertical parts don’t need as much testing as horizontal). But surplus laptops are in such quantity that I’d be fine replacing my tablet with a laptop.

There's always beem a trickle of machines like that. The problem is that they're targeted towards industrial usage and RIOTOUSLY expensive.

https://www.bsicomputer.com/products/fieldgo-m9-1760 for example (the first vendor I saw that actually shows prices, as opposed to just request-for-quote) It starts at nearly $2400 for a low-spec Celeron, and I'm not sure it even has an onboard battery.

What I could see as viable would be a micro-ATX case of similar dimensions, sold as a barebones for like $300-- use the extra volume from not accommodating ATX mainboards to store batteries and charging circuitry, which can be off the shelf because space constraints are minimal. Pop in some reasonably priced desktop components, and you'd have a competent luggable for under $1000.

Re: Thinkpad X210

#286

Post by saagarjha »

Riada wrote: post #132
saagarjha wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I run Linux exclusively on my fanless Chromebook and remote computers, so I guess I kinda do the same thing ;)

What Chromebook do you use if I may ask? Do you use Crouton or did you completely flash Linux on it?

I dual booted on the new Samsung Chromebook 3: https://saagarjha.com/blog/2019/03/13/dual-booting-chrome-os...

Re: Thinkpad X210

#287

Post by manigandham »

jjeaff wrote: post #259
emiliosic wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My office decided to move from Jabber (Pidgin / Adium) to Slack. Much of the office upgraded computers. Whether Jabber is negligible, Slack used más two to three Gb RAM. It’s simply the most inefficient software I have to Tun continuously on that PC

They have raised so much money and have so many engineers. Is performance of their app so low priority that no one is working on that?

Yes. It was first about gaining market share and now it's about integrations to solidify their position against competitors.

Performance is not on the list and probably never will be.

Re: Thinkpad X210

#288

Post by mbell »

hombre_fatal wrote: post #281
mbell wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Activity Monitor itself also consumes a lot of CPU. And you tend to only use it when you've already suspected a problem, like when your fans start running. MacOS always tracks the energy usage stats so you don't have to keep activity monitor open, just look at the 'Average Energy Impact' column. iStats menu also uses a fair bit of CPU, similar to Activity Monitor, it's just split into a couple processes so it doesn…

My main point is that a global CPU graph helps you identify acute CPU consumption as it happens which is the main mechanism that helps me identify things like Spotify getting stuck in a spinlock or a browser tab devouring my battery. Seeing "Google Chrome" show up in Activity Monitor's energy chart when you check it periodically isn't as helpful. Good point about iStat Menus consuming its own resources. It has two pr…

> My main point is that a global CPU graph helps you identify acute CPU consumption as it happens which is the main mechanism that helps me identify things like Spotify getting stuck in a spinlock or a browser tab devouring my battery. Seeing "Google Chrome" show up in Activity Monitor's energy chart when you check it periodically isn't as helpful.

If you want to know 'what is using all by battery' after a couple hours using it, you want to know the average power usage by app, which activity monitor gives you. Battery life is the point of this thread, not random lock ups.

> Good point about iStat Menus consuming its own resources. It has two processes afaict with its main process staying below 1% CPU.

I wish we could just get rid of 'cpu %' as a metric on modern machines, or at least scale it based on P-state. Saying process X is taking Y% of the CPU is pointless if you don't also communicate the P-state, and chances are you don't even know which core the process is running. Point is, I'm sitting here almost completely idle and there are plenty of tasks 'using 3-5% of my CPU', of course the CPU is running at 800MHz no where near it's all core peak of 2.7Ghz, much less it's single core peak of 4.5Ghz. What does 1% CPU even mean in this world?

Re: Thinkpad X210

#289

Post by pascoej »

I went and visited their office in SZ last summer to buy one of these motherboards.

I was amazed that it seemed like a 5-7 person operation and they designed a modern laptop motherboard. Maybe they contracted out some work and the office was mostly just operational people, but it was really cool to talk to a bunch of retro thinkpad enthusiasts making what they love.

Re: Thinkpad X210

#290

Post by conradfr »

syntaxing wrote: post #43
saagarjha wrote: post #6

> Battery life is a little over 4 hours with the flush battery (55Wh) and 6-7 hours with the extended battery (80Wh). Not going to lie, that’s pretty horrible. > Battery life would increase by 50% if I got PC6 or PC8 idle states. The fan only turns on if I’m doing something intensive like compiling go or scrolling in Slack. lol. One of the things that really drives me nuts is my computer’s fan turning on when I know…

You should see my X62, the battery is so bad. I even bought a "brand new" battery and it last about 2 hours. We don't notice it but battery technology has really pushed forward since a decade ago.

I have a non-ssd Asus u36sd from 2011 running Windows 7 that still has around 5 hours of battery life with moderate screen brightness, a Jetbrains IDE running alongside a vagrant VM, Firefox, music etc, so I think you should or could do better.

My more recent Macbook pro at work is basically worst though, not sure why.

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