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The difference between ‘broke’ and ‘poor’

theguardian.com

21–30 of 234 posts

Re: The difference between ‘broke’ and ‘poor’

#21
post #4

Leaving aside the politics of a universal basic income, would a UBI have helped or hindered this person? Do most UBI schemes assume that healthcare subsidies would stop for instance, and the money be redirected to the UBI? Or would the income be on top of whatever healthcare subsidies already exist?

The author is Canadian, in which case the assumption would probably be that universal single-payer insurance is in place rather than individualized subsidies.

Re: The difference between ‘broke’ and ‘poor’

#23

In my early 20's I had a girlfriend who was raised in Colombia and immigrated to the US in her teens. I remember one day recounting some bullshit middle-class slogan about how "it's better to be poor and happy, than rich and sad". She slapped me across the face and yelled at me. Passionate as she was she'd never done anything like that before. She told me what it was like growing up so poor you can't afford toothpast…

[flagged]

Re: The difference between ‘broke’ and ‘poor’

#24
post #7

And this is in Canada, where the author's surgery and other medical care was covered in full by universal health care. Without that, her situation likely would have been far worse, and yet we can still do so much better.

If you are poor in the US your healthcare costs will mostly or entirely be covered. This includes major surgery.

Re: The difference between ‘broke’ and ‘poor’

#25

In my early 20's I had a girlfriend who was raised in Colombia and immigrated to the US in her teens. I remember one day recounting some bullshit middle-class slogan about how "it's better to be poor and happy, than rich and sad". She slapped me across the face and yelled at me. Passionate as she was she'd never done anything like that before. She told me what it was like growing up so poor you can't afford toothpast…

Colombia, right?

Re: The difference between ‘broke’ and ‘poor’

#26
post #20

In my early 20's I had a girlfriend who was raised in Colombia and immigrated to the US in her teens. I remember one day recounting some bullshit middle-class slogan about how "it's better to be poor and happy, than rich and sad". She slapped me across the face and yelled at me. Passionate as she was she'd never done anything like that before. She told me what it was like growing up so poor you can't afford toothpast…

You're both right. Research shows that more money doesn't make you happier - after around 80k a year in family income. Before 80k a year (depending on location, etc, I think that was the average for the USA), every dollar absolutely makes you happier with a linear line graph. This is also a great argument for more marginal taxation.

If 80k/yr is considered poor, then sure, but that’s absurd. She was right. He was wrong.

Re: The difference between ‘broke’ and ‘poor’

#27
post #10
post #4

Leaving aside the politics of a universal basic income, would a UBI have helped or hindered this person? Do most UBI schemes assume that healthcare subsidies would stop for instance, and the money be redirected to the UBI? Or would the income be on top of whatever healthcare subsidies already exist?

I think the article is a good example of why universal healthcare would have to remain in place when UBI is implemented. UBI is unlikely to be enough to afford quality healthcare.

Or even some base level of healthcare for anything remotely serious. It's implicit in UBI that it would have to be paired with something along the lines of universal Medicaid. Otherwise, an income that is truly base--say $8K/year in the US--is not going to have any real slack to cover healthcare.

Re: The difference between ‘broke’ and ‘poor’

#29
post #2

Poverty especially sucks when you're all alone like it seems this person was. Where I grew up, most of the people were poor, but we had rich lives for the most part. Lots of family dinners and outings. The people with more would let you take the leftovers home. You can't really train this and we all definitely need a social safety net, but I do think our closed off society prevents us from helping each other too.

Yup, to some degree if you have the money you can buy yourself a safety net. If you neither have money nor the social safety net, the thing left is what government may provide. I grew up with a divorced mother that could provide only a small social safety net through family and an unstable financial situation. Although my financial situation is very stable since I've graduated - with small gaps - I'm extremely carefu…

We all have to do our part to extend safety nets to those in our spheres of influence. I have done very well in life, mostly through what I attribute to luck and being at the right place at the right time. In return, I treat checking in and providing a helping hand (temporary housing, an extra line on my cellphone plan, or in some cases plain old cash) to extended family, friends, and others I encounter as a second job.

Societal fabric isn’t going to be solved through anything other than effort on the part of individuals.

Re: The difference between ‘broke’ and ‘poor’

#30
post #10
post #4

Leaving aside the politics of a universal basic income, would a UBI have helped or hindered this person? Do most UBI schemes assume that healthcare subsidies would stop for instance, and the money be redirected to the UBI? Or would the income be on top of whatever healthcare subsidies already exist?

I think the article is a good example of why universal healthcare would have to remain in place when UBI is implemented. UBI is unlikely to be enough to afford quality healthcare.

Agreed. There are two types of healthcare expenses that insurance is important for:

1) massive, unexpected ones, which $1000 a month would be useless towards, and where the word "insurance" actually makes sense

2) recurring costs like doctor appointments, prescriptions, and teeth cleaning, which could arguably (but still probably shouldn't) be lumped in with UBI

#2 can still wreck someone who's truly poor, to be clear, but the author's case sounded more like #1

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