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California declared drought free for first time in seven years

reuters.com

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Re: California declared drought free for first time in seven years

#91

Post by SubiculumCode »

SovietDissident wrote: post #68

Yes, but have the bozos in Sac learned anything? Have we built new water infrastructure to support a population 3x the size vs. when the original, now-ageing infrastructure was built? Was there a cessation of 40% of freshwater being drained into the oceans to preserve the habitats of baitfish and other environmentalist causes? No---we told farmers they were evil because they grow almonds, told people they need to con…

In general your response is stylized as over-the-top and bombastic, which generally leads me to dismiss your argument as yet another rant from the angry and incomprehensible internet denizen. In any case, the magnitude of the problem makes solutions politically quite difficult and expensive, not only from vested water interests, but in the need for grand construction projects that will necessarily involve winners and losers from stakeholders, and by those who abhor exorbitant state spending. That is, this is more than a problem of legislative and/or executive incompetence.

That said, the problem you outline is very much real. My mother runs a small rural water district in the central valley. The drought crisis was very real to the water district as their wells began to fail due to lowering of the water tables. Getting someone to dig a new and deeper well cost money the district did not have, and moreover, well diggers were in such demand that you couldn't get a new well dug for months. That said, they applied and acquired a water grant from California to improve the districts infrastructure, so new wells are being dug thanks to California grants.

The California aquifers, irrespective of current drought status, should be considered a valuable and scarce resource for many years now, as it will take a long time to restore the water table after decades of abuse. New sources of water and water storage absolutely need to be developed, and should be a top priority.

Re: California declared drought free for first time in seven years

#92

Post by jmeekr »

zobzu wrote: post #85

its funny how no matter what happens climate wise "its terrible and wrong" when it's reported. What drought.gov calls abnormally-dry is not actually abnormal. What they really mean is "its non-ideal", as if the climate was always ideal pre-2011. Anything that is lower than D2 ("severe drought") is normal, and of course its better to thrive toward ideal and maintaining better conditions. But it doesn't mean that someh…

1984 vibes in a way if you think about it.

Re: California declared drought free for first time in seven years

#93

Post by bdamm »

ceejayoz wrote: post #57
Varcht wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is sort of a trope in CA, oh and it's the deltas, are you saying that stinking up their bathrooms with un-flushed urine and being charged a surcharge to save 10% of 10% of the available water is logical? Isn't it really just a "feel good" thing?

Australian toilets frequently have two buttons, one for a small flush (for urine) and another for a larger flush. "No flushing" is hardly the only option. California needs to tackle water usage. There are reasonable changes that can be made in homes and towns - swapping to drought-resistant gardens instead of lawns, rain barrels to catch run-off, absorbent parking lots that don't drain out to the sewers, etc. Agricul…

This style of toilet is already very common in California, as is drought resistant landscaping. There could be more, but California could already be past 50% towards best case on those approaches.

Re: California declared drought free for first time in seven years

#94

Post by maxxxxx »

mamon wrote: post #41
jdminhbg wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe people should stop claiming normal patterns of precipitation variability are unstoppable catastrophic results of climate change then?

Also, climate change might have catastropthic results on some parts of the world, and positive effect on other. I wouldn't mind for instance if Central Europe got warm climate similar to Mediterranean. Now, why would I fight a change that clearly benefits me? :)

In principle you have a point but if millions of people have to leave their home area and are looking for a place to live things may be less golden.

the same thing happened in Syria. The war there didn't really impact Europe directly but the refugees certainly did.

Re: California declared drought free for first time in seven years

#95

Post by maxxxxx »

mrfusion wrote: post #75
whalesalad wrote: post #27

The experience here in Orange County over the last few months has been nuts. Being able to hang out down near the ocean and see the San Gabriel mountains just decked out in snow is surreal: https://i.redd.it/kueaye5p6si21.jpg Another photo: https://i.redd.it/vy7dlavrh0f21.jpg Anaheim hills, an area that rarely gets snowed on: https://i.redd.it/trbf198kb6i21.jpg Then we roll right into the poppy/wildflower superbloom…

I thought California. Has the best climate in the country?

Along the coast and in some mountain areas it's perfect. Otherwise it's a f...ing desert.

Re: California declared drought free for first time in seven years

#96

Post by gwbas1c »

benj111 wrote: post #36
jayess wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> “The reservoirs are full, lakes are full, the streams are flowing, there’s tons of snow,” said Jessica Blunden, a climate scientist with the National Climatic Data Center at the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. “All the drought is officially gone.” https://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-rain-california... EDIT: Sorry, you're referring to aquifers, not reservoirs.

This quote gets me thinking about how snow is treated in this system. It isn't like water in a stream because it stays where it is. It isn't like a reservoir or aquifer because the water isn't trivially dispatchable. I suppose it depends where the snow is, some could be 'permanent', some seasonal melt, some gone by next week. So really we should be differentiating the different types of snow?

It all melts.

I trust that the experts know the difference between permanent snow and annual melting. They use satellite pictures to determine how much water will be available after it melts.

Edit: If someone knows more about the planning process than I do, please chime in.

Re: California declared drought free for first time in seven years

#97

Post by _2d30 »

zobzu wrote: post #85

its funny how no matter what happens climate wise "its terrible and wrong" when it's reported. What drought.gov calls abnormally-dry is not actually abnormal. What they really mean is "its non-ideal", as if the climate was always ideal pre-2011. Anything that is lower than D2 ("severe drought") is normal, and of course its better to thrive toward ideal and maintaining better conditions. But it doesn't mean that someh…

I actually agree with the core sentiment of your post, but find you playing a victim without yet being victimized in any way with "Let the downvotes flow..." to be really counter productive.

Re: California declared drought free for first time in seven years

#98

Post by everdev »

zobzu wrote: post #85

its funny how no matter what happens climate wise "its terrible and wrong" when it's reported. What drought.gov calls abnormally-dry is not actually abnormal. What they really mean is "its non-ideal", as if the climate was always ideal pre-2011. Anything that is lower than D2 ("severe drought") is normal, and of course its better to thrive toward ideal and maintaining better conditions. But it doesn't mean that someh…

> Abnormally Dry:

  * Short-term dryness slowing planting, growth of crops
  * Some lingering water deficits
  * Pastures or crops not fully recovered
Maybe it's a confusing use of the word. I think they might just mean that the area is still experiencing residual effects of the drought.

Re: California declared drought free for first time in seven years

#99

Post by tomjakubowski »

_2d30 wrote: post #97
zobzu wrote: post #85

its funny how no matter what happens climate wise "its terrible and wrong" when it's reported. What drought.gov calls abnormally-dry is not actually abnormal. What they really mean is "its non-ideal", as if the climate was always ideal pre-2011. Anything that is lower than D2 ("severe drought") is normal, and of course its better to thrive toward ideal and maintaining better conditions. But it doesn't mean that someh…

I actually agree with the core sentiment of your post, but find you playing a victim without yet being victimized in any way with "Let the downvotes flow..." to be really counter productive.

Could you rephrase the core sentiment of the post that you agree with? I can't understand what it's saying at all, other than expressing anger at the reporting of climate issues.

Re: California declared drought free for first time in seven years

#100

Post by butstillbad99 »

zobzu wrote: post #85

its funny how no matter what happens climate wise "its terrible and wrong" when it's reported. What drought.gov calls abnormally-dry is not actually abnormal. What they really mean is "its non-ideal", as if the climate was always ideal pre-2011. Anything that is lower than D2 ("severe drought") is normal, and of course its better to thrive toward ideal and maintaining better conditions. But it doesn't mean that someh…

Thanks for the clinical discussion around environmental droughts.

As usual such technical views ignore the on-the-ground experience for people to provide context for the language you’re criticizing.

Yes, to the ecosystem itself, in a vacuum, it’s not bad.

To human existence there it’s been problematic. Emotions are up over it. Perhaps that’s an alternative argument you’re not considering?

This is like telling people dealing with cancer “We all die some day.”

Damn those humans and their generalizing to maintain social connection. We should all just stick to highly technical interpretations (even though not all of us want to!)

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