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Facebook Loses Top Executives, Including Chris Cox

nytimes.com

311–320 of 414 posts

Re: Facebook Loses Top Executives, Including Chris Cox

#311
post #145

Why would anyone want to work for Facebook these days? When you are maintaining the largest advertising stream since TV while actively destroying society's discourse, I'm not sure what redeeming qualities it has. I think the most important thing any of us can do is get away from Facebook and move towards pursuits that fix problems, including the ones Facebook helped create.

My wife has been doing taxes for a few people at Facebook (including engineers and PMs) -- many of them make an absurd amount of money. (>$800k / year)

That's great for the ones that make that much, but this kind of information is what's causing Bay Area housing and rent prices to sky-rocket. I have worked with multiple engineers in two large corps and most people make anywhere between 100k and 200k.

Re: Facebook Loses Top Executives, Including Chris Cox

#312
post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not exactly. Tobacco has no benefits to society except possibly a dopamine hit for the user. Facebook has a lot of positives to go along with its negatives. For me, it's the only way I stay in touch with a lot of my friends from high school. And I know that it's only because of Facebook, because Facebook didn't exist for the first 10 years after I graduated, and most of my friends didn't get on it until about 15 year…

I hear this quite a lot from the people who have worked at "damaging" companies (facebook, reddit, twitter, uber) but I still have to wonder if the personal benefits these platforms bring are really worth the societal cost, and if people are just using the idea that they can "change things from inside" as a justification for taking money to damage the world. Don't get me wrong, I think that communication is great. It…

It’s sounds like you’re arguing we should shut down the Internet.

Re: Facebook Loses Top Executives, Including Chris Cox

#313
post #143

I've known Chris Cox since freshman year of college and he was an informal advisor to my first startup. The NYT article referenced in hashberry's earlier comment includes a key quote: “For over a decade, I’ve been sharing the same message that Mark and I have always believed: Social media’s history is not yet written, and its effects are not neutral,” Mr. Cox said in a note to employees on Thursday. “As its builders…

"Zuckerberg's vision of Facebook as a good thing for the world was a lie" - That is such a broad generalization. In the developing world where I live Facebook gives me the opportunity to maintain contact with my family who live on the other side of the world, as I walk the streets of São Paulo, for free. There are hundreds of millions of others like me who keep in contact with their family because of Facebook (and th…

The chat and image service both have many alternatives. Many people do not use Facebook but still use these services.

Re: Facebook Loses Top Executives, Including Chris Cox

#314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We've already had a look inside his head, because he joked with his friends about how naive the people giving their information to him were for trusting, and how they were dumb fucks that he looked forward to fucking in the ear. Sure, he might have changed since, but there's nothing wrong with rational speculation. Selfishness and greed are real phenomena in human relations so it would be as foolish to ignore such po…

> We've already had a look inside his head, because he joked with his friends about how naive the people giving their information to him were for trusting, and how they were dumb fucks that he looked forward to fucking in the ear. You're reading a lot into a (admittedly stupid) quip/jab/whatever-you-want-to-call it by a 19 year old. I don't even disagree with your fundamental assertion here, just that this is incredi…

I was 19 and didn't talk like that. Doesn't it say something about a person's personality?

Re: Facebook Loses Top Executives, Including Chris Cox

#315

I used to be a fan of Facebook, but I was never obsessed with it. I even used to work there. I'm over it. It's useful for groups, some of the ads really are useful, it's nice to sometimes keep up with people that are far away, but the news feed has had done way more harm than good for our society, including my own life. After the 2016 Election, Facebook posts lead to so much drama in my family that certain "branches"…

> There is no way to turn this part of the feed off. Unfollow everyone, and you don't get sucked into interacting with the facebook feed. Use it for Messenger, groups, and events. I've been doing that, and facebook is a perfectly good communication utility without any of the grief. Honestly, we as users should demand a simple switch that entirely disables the feed. It turns facebook from a socially messy skinner box…

I use this to remove the feed: https://github.com/jordwest/news-feed-eradicator/

Periodically I go and read through the feeds of family and friends when they happen to be on my mind.

Re: Facebook Loses Top Executives, Including Chris Cox

#316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> For all of us, Facebook is definitely a good thing. And also a bad thing, is a major theme of the parent comment you replied to. "Lie" is a stark word for what Zuck is doing, but it's not wrong assuming he understands the dark side of his monster. But he also may not know if he's actively deluding himself, and eliminating everyone around him that doesn't support that pretend worldview.

As much as I distrust his motives, there is this in TFA: > Now, Mr. Zuckerberg is barreling ahead with his shift to focus Facebook on private messaging and away from public broadcasting, even if it means shedding some of his top lieutenants. That sounds a lot like "understand[ing] the dark side of his monster". Maybe an extreme overreaction, it's true. But a clear acknowledgment that "sharing will make the world a be…

Wasn't it the culture he built which led to the many iterations of permissions which were intentionally confusing in order to get you to share everything more publicly than you thought you were?

See: http://www.nbcnews.com/id/34825225/ns/technology_and_science...

Re: Facebook Loses Top Executives, Including Chris Cox

#317
post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Zuckerberg's vision of Facebook as a good thing for the world was a lie" - That is such a broad generalization. In the developing world where I live Facebook gives me the opportunity to maintain contact with my family who live on the other side of the world, as I walk the streets of São Paulo, for free. There are hundreds of millions of others like me who keep in contact with their family because of Facebook (and th…

> Facebook gives me the opportunity to maintain contact with my family who live on the other side of the world, as I walk the streets of São Paulo, for free. [...] The alternative (cel phone calls and sms) I use email to keep in contact with my family. CC everyone, then reply all. No Facebook required.

Facebook messaging has less support issues than email plus ...emojis.

Re: Facebook Loses Top Executives, Including Chris Cox

#318

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ironically the fear-mongering about the propaganda campaign you are describing is intended to turn Facebook into an instrument of US government propaganda. Zuckerberg has been resisting that, which is why Facebook is being attacked from all sides at the moment.

The US government has unlimited resources. If they want to use Facebook as a propaganda platform, they would do so, and Facebook would happily accept their cash. The Russian campaign that you’re dismissive of is consistent with the heritage of Russian intelligence services. Lenin’s newspaper was called “Iskra” (spark) in the context of “from a spark a fire will flare up.” The army of trolls is there to foment dissent…

> Facebook would happily accept their cash

It's not so simple, because not all employees would go along with it. It's possible that Zuck is stalling so he can figure out how to deliver what he's being asked for without creating too much turmoil.

> consistent with the heritage of Russian intelligence services

And also consistent with US intelligence services and a historic tit for tat. Russia's alleged $150K spend is being amplified because it fits the desired narrative, which is that social media needs to be much better controlled/censored, in this case for alleged national security reasons.

> guy who is over his head ... without the foresight and vision to be a steward of it or the humility to delegate it... harming the republic and the world

I would rephrase this as follows: A guy built an incredibly successful great firewall with built-in social credit system. In spite of his youth and inexperience he created something that governments have sought to create and control since before the modern information age. Now that he's created it and its value is (finally) understood by political leaders, there exists a desire to confiscate/control it to use it for the benefit of the republic.

The impact of FB's news feed algorithm on the 2016 election dramatically accelerated the power grab. Zuck saw this move early which is why he testified to congress that "Facebook should probably be regulated". He is insisting on overt, public regulation of something he sees as a public utility, but officials have their eye on the much bigger prize which is the great firewall + social credit system. Such a thing requires secrecy and of course does not resemble Zuck's concept of a public utility.

Re: Facebook Loses Top Executives, Including Chris Cox

#319
post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ironically the fear-mongering about the propaganda campaign you are describing is intended to turn Facebook into an instrument of US government propaganda. Zuckerberg has been resisting that, which is why Facebook is being attacked from all sides at the moment.

I've been saying that Facebook would do these things since around 2008. And now you're here telling me I'm part of some fear mongering campaing orchestrated by the US government. That's beyond absurd.

My comment was not directed at you personally or at your past views on the subject.

Re: Facebook Loses Top Executives, Including Chris Cox

#320
post #143

I've known Chris Cox since freshman year of college and he was an informal advisor to my first startup. The NYT article referenced in hashberry's earlier comment includes a key quote: “For over a decade, I’ve been sharing the same message that Mark and I have always believed: Social media’s history is not yet written, and its effects are not neutral,” Mr. Cox said in a note to employees on Thursday. “As its builders…

"Zuckerberg's vision of Facebook as a good thing for the world was a lie" - That is such a broad generalization. In the developing world where I live Facebook gives me the opportunity to maintain contact with my family who live on the other side of the world, as I walk the streets of São Paulo, for free. There are hundreds of millions of others like me who keep in contact with their family because of Facebook (and th…

> The alternative (cel phone calls and sms) is literally an inch away on our smartphone, but it is such bad quality and so expensive its unusable. For all of us, Facebook is definitely a good thing.

I'm sorry but I don't buy this at all. There are so many alternatives to facebook that are also free (i.e. skype or email) beyond "cel phone calls and sms".

You've simply become accustomed to the __convenience__ of facebook. That convenience has enabled you to interact with more people, and given you a sense of increased / improved connection with the world. But has the quality of those interactions improved? The world (including these execs) says no, on the contrary, interactions on facebook are oftentimes shallow and insignificant.

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