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Online activists are silencing us, scientists say

reuters.com

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Re: Online activists are silencing us, scientists say

#221

Post by schlagetown »

This article seems to gloss over possible physical causes for CFS/ME, sort of implying that nobody has any idea what physical basis there might be for it. But that's…not entirely true?

For example, there's at least some evidence linking it to mitochondrial dysfunction, see e.g.: https://me-pedia.org/wiki/Mitochondria

> There is evidence of mitochondrial dysfunction in chronic fatigue syndrome patients. Muscle biopsies have shown evidence of mitochondrial degeneration, deletions of mitochondrial DNA, the reduction of mitochondrial activity, and Sarah Myhill found measurable mitochondrial dysfunction correlating with severity of illness. Myhill also produced improvement by targeting those dysfunctions. Mitochondrial DNA variants correlate with symptoms, symptom clusters & symptom severity.

Far from conclusive, but I think worth at least noting.

From both reading a variety of sources on the topic, and having someone close to me with CFS/ME for many years, I think it's pretty clear that a) there's most likely a physical basis for it, b) we don't yet know how it works, and c) research on this is drastically underfunded.

Considering millions of people are affected, there should be way more resources put towards it. Hundreds of millions of dollars per year, to put it on par with funding of similar diseases. (See: https://www.meaction.net/2017/01/07/dimmock-mirin-jason-esti...)

Re: Online activists are silencing us, scientists say

#222

Post by Emma_Goldman »

ddorian43 wrote: post #114
SolaceQuantum wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have evidence of your claim that "These topics are so sensitive because of the current political climate that they are literally career suicide for any western scientist."? For example, an investigative piece similar to the one here, except about behavioral genetics?

See anyone who has touched "differences of iq between races".

Natural selection acts to increase the fitness of a species relative to its environment. In the human case 'race' is a misnomer. It simply refers to certain features of humans' external appearance, namely melanin. But this does not track any distinct genetic community, which primarily changes as a function of the total sum of environmental pressures, and not just in proportion to UV radiation (i.e. as is true of melanin). It is difficult to take anyone seriously who uses race as a meaningful biological category.

Re: Online activists are silencing us, scientists say

#224

Post by pas »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #207
bryanlarsen wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is significantly more genetic variety in the single black "race" than all others put together. You could try dividing blacks into three or twelve different races but those lines are quite difficult to draw. Any statement which considers black a single race and white and Oriental distinct is automatically suspect.

> There is significantly more genetic variety in the single black "race" than all others put together. You could try dividing blacks into three or twelve different races but those lines are quite difficult to draw. Not only that, people want to continue using the existing (extremely flawed) categories, and that's where it leads you to problems. "More genetic variety in a single race than between races" is a great arg…

> it's completely possible that a major cause is that the median in that arbitrarily defined racial category is below the median in another arbitrarily defined racial category.

Sure, possible, in the sense of theoretically possible. But very unlikely as socioeconomic factors potentially dwarf all of the aggregate group differences.

Re: Online activists are silencing us, scientists say

#225

Post by vectorEQ »

sleepysysadmin wrote: post #69

I feel like the topic of CFS is irrelevant to the story. Why is there such toxicity online creating these echochambers. If you point out anything that might question climate change for example, you will be called all kinds of names. Nobody looks at the points you are making. Let's test it right now. I'm sure I'll get downvoted and nobody will respond. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geologic_temperature_record#/m... Ov…

it's not good nor bad. that's an opinion, and opinions have no place in the realm of science. that being said. climate change is natural, and has been going on without humans, and will do so after we are long gone

Re: Online activists are silencing us, scientists say

#226

Post by flatline »

mcv wrote: post #95
nateberkopec wrote: post #10

Over the next 20 or so years, expect a lot of syndromes/conditions to be reclassified, as Michael Sharpe puts in the article, as "biological condition[s] that can be perpetuated by social and psychological factors.". I struggled with RSI for a couple of years until I read John Sarno's "The Mind-Body Connection" on the recommendation of someone from HN. Sarno's thesis is that many chronic pain conditions (those withou…

> those without a clear physical mechanism, such as RSI or chronic back pain But RSI has a clear physical mechanism. I don't know as much about chronic back pain, but considering how much physical stuff there is in our back, I'd assume it's similar. Or does "physical mechanism" mean something other than it seems to mean?

For example, everyone’s disks degenerate with old age. They squash, bulge, even herniate. But only some people experience notable pain from this. And back pain has been a growing epidemic for decades!

Are there physiological differences between people that explain this? Probably. But I suspect in many cases Sarno is right, it’s not purely physical. Look into neuromatrix theory and non-proprioceptive pain for a somewhat more scientific attempt at an explanation.

Re: Online activists are silencing us, scientists say

#227

Post by fenomas »

ddorian43 wrote: post #162
bryanlarsen wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is significantly more genetic variety in the single black "race" than all others put together. You could try dividing blacks into three or twelve different races but those lines are quite difficult to draw. Any statement which considers black a single race and white and Oriental distinct is automatically suspect.

Can you compare them after you split them ? Or are you saying you can't even compare them ? Can you compare "black races" with "asian races" ?

You can compare any groups you like, but only after you've decided who goes into which group. The point being made here is that with race, that decision is subjective, and heavily influenced by various social factors unrelated to people's genetics and so forth.

Re: Online activists are silencing us, scientists say

#228

Post by nateberkopec »

vgoh1 wrote: post #188
nateberkopec wrote: post #10

Over the next 20 or so years, expect a lot of syndromes/conditions to be reclassified, as Michael Sharpe puts in the article, as "biological condition[s] that can be perpetuated by social and psychological factors.". I struggled with RSI for a couple of years until I read John Sarno's "The Mind-Body Connection" on the recommendation of someone from HN. Sarno's thesis is that many chronic pain conditions (those withou…

When I was a child, I would suffer from terrible muscle contractions in my calves. I would get a charlie horse in the middle of the night, and it would not go away completely for over a day. I couldn't put my foot flat to walk properly, and it was very painful. After about a dozen of these attacks, I noticed a pattern - they would occur on the night before something that I was dreading - a test I wasn't prepared for,…

> Once I realized this, it never came back again.

This was the same for me with RSI. It was simply the act of realizing it was psychosomatic and caused by stress that made it disappear completely.

Re: Online activists are silencing us, scientists say

#229

Post by maerF0x0 »

cm2187 wrote: post #31

Another field where science is on a collision course with online (and offline) activists is genetics. As we decode and understand more of the genome, it is possible that our genes affect more of our behavior than what the partisans of tabula rasa hold for truth. And unless the political climate evolves, in a power struggle between activists and science, I wouldn't bet on the scientists.

> And unless the political climate evolves, in a power struggle between activists and science

In the long run the truth wins out because generally it has an advantage -- it knows what works and what doesnt.

Re: Online activists are silencing us, scientists say

#230

Post by jcranberry »

ddorian43 wrote: post #114
SolaceQuantum wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have evidence of your claim that "These topics are so sensitive because of the current political climate that they are literally career suicide for any western scientist."? For example, an investigative piece similar to the one here, except about behavioral genetics?

See anyone who has touched "differences of iq between races".

IQ is a terrible example. It can be trained, with some examples of increases of up to 30 points. It regresses to the mean. Correlation between IQ of parents and children is lower at birth and increases up until around 18 (Wilson Effect). At younger influences it is strongly influenced by your environment. And not too long ago it was found that all the genes associated with IQ were false positives.
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