Didn't TouchStream buy up all this IP in multiple ways then get bought by Apple? I still have a functional touchstream and it's a fantastic device. The drivers even still sort work on Linux.
I thought FingerWorks did their own R&D.
A Touchpad Embedded Keyboard
101–110 of 118 posts
Re: A Touchpad Embedded Keyboard
#102As a side note, I am perplexed by the:
> Mokibo saves 60% of mode chnage between keyboard and touchpad which are 50-100 hours in a year.
Does really that (or keyboard/mouse change) amount to 50-100 hours in a year?
Re: A Touchpad Embedded Keyboard
#103I don't get it. The "keep your fingers on the keyboard and use the mouse" thing has been solved ages ago with the trackpoint [1]. It's the number one reason for me not to buy a MacBook. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pointing_stick
I got a mechanical keyboard without a trackpoint after requiring one for many years. I was worried about using a trackpad or mouse, but I tried out mousekeys and am very happy with the result.
Just got started using mousekeys thanks to your comment, and I like 'em thus far. I can't do as precise of movements as I can with a mouse yet, but it is nice to not have to switch to the mouse, and it doesn't hurt my wrist as much to use.
Re: A Touchpad Embedded Keyboard
#104Earlier quoted context omitted.
A lot of people don't want to take the time and/or lose the flow due to shifting the hands away from the keyboard and in particular orientation with the home row. The laptop approach of the touchpad close to and rigidly coupled to the keyboard is a big improvement as you can move thumbs from the spacebar and back without looking. This is why I use the internal keyboard even when an external keyboard would be otherwis…
I'm dreaming of a keyboard where the touchpad would be placed in the middle between the two halves for left and right hand. Because arms aren't growing in front of people's bodies (as e.g. Kinesis well know). Still waiting for which manufacturer has this idea first. But the thing in the post might be a better solution if both the keyboard and the touchpad work well. A great illustration of the classic principle: good…
There's split keyboards that have a trackball in the middle, like the Ultimate Hacker Keyboard[0]. There's also the KeyMouse[1], which is two wireless mice with split mechanical keyboards built into them
[0]https://ultimatehackingkeyboard.com/ [1]https://ultimatehackingkeyboard.com/
Re: A Touchpad Embedded Keyboard
#105Earlier quoted context omitted.
> A lot of people don't want to take the time and/or lose the flow due to shifting the hands away from the keyboard and in particular orientation with the home row. TrackPoint. You want a TrackPoint.
I liked the idea but it never exhibited the dynamic performance (accelleration-to-distance/decelleration-to-precision) of a trackpad which is why I think it faded away, even at IBM.
>which is why I think it faded away
You do realise trackpoints still exist on all new thinkpads and some Dell and HP laptops?
the reason they never became popular is that they are ont easy to master as soon as you first use them. the muscle patterns take a fair bit of getting used to before you get out of the awkward stage. However once you do they are as precise (if not more so) than touchpads with out having to move you hands into an entirely new position (much like this touchpad keyboard) however I think for this new keyboard to be effective, the activation force on the keys is going to need to be too high to resist accidental keypresses while using as a touchpad.
I think I'll stick with the trackpoint thanks.
Re: A Touchpad Embedded Keyboard
#106I don't get it. The "keep your fingers on the keyboard and use the mouse" thing has been solved ages ago with the trackpoint [1]. It's the number one reason for me not to buy a MacBook. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pointing_stick
Figuring out how to disable that damn thing was my top priority when I had a thinkpad. Maybe I should have stuck with it, but it was just an annoying thing that was impossible to control and easily knocked to where I didn't want it to be (a problem when input focus is mouse based rather than foreground app based). So this looks interesting to me... but possibly suffers from the same problem of inadvertent activation.
there's definitely a steeper muscle learning curve with a trackpoint but once you get past it they are fantastic to use. I find accuracy higher and less of a jarring transition from typing to mousing. if you get one again, I suggest persevering (it took trying to play populous 3 on my dad's laptop Back in the day to convince me that a trackpoint was the way forward. I pushed through the mental barrier and found that P3 was an order of magnitude easier to play on a trackpoint than a touchpad) since then i've been a convert and actively stipulated that my last laptop HAVE a trackpoint. So I bought a thinkpad after having/hating a macbook for a while.
Re: A Touchpad Embedded Keyboard
#107so glad to see this come into existence. being able to type and direct the cursor from the same region is long overdue
Re: A Touchpad Embedded Keyboard
#108Earlier quoted context omitted.
> touch typing doesn't help you position your hands when moving them from something else to the keyboard. I thought that's what the bumps on the f and j keys were for.
They are rather small and take a bit of work to find when you are blind.
I have this problem on ‘j’ but not on ‘f’―the comparison lead me to the thought that I really should glue a grain of plastic on the ‘j’. We here are supposed to be hackers and to do-it-ourselves, after all.
The same can be done to other keys, I think―if you have the unfortunate configuration of an unsplit F-row, for example.
Re: A Touchpad Embedded Keyboard
#109Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not sure how it’s any better than the Logitech K400 or the Microsoft All in One keyboard, especially since those don’t need any special software support so can work with your Android TV, Apple TV, HTPC and essentially any other device that supports USB HID, and those cost only like $20-30 I don’t see this thing being sold for less than $150-200.
I have only owned the Logitech K400 before and its touchpad is rubbish. I threw it out because it was so frustrating to use. Lots of accidental taps when just trying to move the mouse pointer and issues like that. Is the Microsoft All In One any better?
I'm using the Logitech K830. I don't have many issues with the trackpad on that model. It's not great, like your average Windows laptop's trackpad, but I nowhere near throwing it out cause it's so bad.
Re: A Touchpad Embedded Keyboard
#110Earlier quoted context omitted.
The trackpoint on my x220 was very convenient, but it really hurt my fingers.
You need to edit the sensitivity, on Linux this is done with synclient. The defaults can be ridiculous and absurdly bad. They quite arguably aren't right for anyone on the planet... Don't know why it ships like that (baseline usability shouldn't necessitate customization). Also there's different concavity nibbles and people have very religious-like preferences for one style over another so I won't disclose my persuas…
> need to edit the sensitivity, on Linux this is done with synclient
Default TrackPoint handling is now libinput (as of 2017?)
And regrettably, this regressed acceleration profile editing on older TrackPoint hardware. Apparently it was diverse and buggy, and libinput developer resources are limited, so older ThinkPads may need to update their firmware, or are simply wontfix.
When your TrackPoint has a good acceleration profile, it can be magical. When not, it feels like you're fighting the stick, and stressing your finger. I have one of each, so going back on forth, I get both "oh, wow, this is awesome!" and "yipes, this awful".
TrackPoint seems an odd case. Laptop hardware not working on linux is a familiar thing. But unless you know what you're missing, you may not recognize a severely-suboptimally configured TrackPoint. And without customization, your default TrackPoint experience can be really bad.