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CERN cuts ties with 'sexist' scientist Alessandro Strumia

bbc.com

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Re: CERN cuts ties with 'sexist' scientist Alessandro Strumia

#251

Post by sedachv »

Fins wrote: post #112
sedachv wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Cultural Marxism" is neither about culture nor about Marxism. The term was coined by anti-Semite William Lind in a speech at a 2002 Holocaust denial conference: https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/intelligence-report/... The fact that Peterson adopted the term does not necessarily imply that Peterson is an anti-Semite, but it definitely confirms that he is an idiot who cannot even be bothered to do basic researc…

But that "cultural marxism" label might be neither very cultural nor particularly marxist does not mean that what it labels isn't for the most part senseless bunk either. Oh, and marxism does happen to be more popular in academia than it deserves, too.

What does a simple idea like "stop treating women as though they were all idiots" have to do with any particular culture? If you don't understand the difference between "stop insulting your female colleagues" and Marxist economics or politics, obviously the problem is that there is not too much, but too little Marxism being taught in academia.

Re: CERN cuts ties with 'sexist' scientist Alessandro Strumia

#252

Post by rayiner »

paganel wrote: post #121
jmole wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been reading recently about a structural/sociocultural/technological phenomenon that's actually holding women back in a field where women tend to dominate in representation at the academic level, but are regularly outcompeted by men at the professional level. Piano playing. It all comes down to the shape of the instrument, and hand-span, which is unquestionably (and uncontroversially) larger in men than in women…

This could go the other way, like you might be seen as saying that women don't have hand-spans as big as men, meaning that they're not as good as men when it comes to their physical capabilities and as such "providing" them with smaller pianos might be looked at as "demeaning" towards said women (you're thinking about them as not being as good as men are). Gender politics can be fun like that.

> Gender politics can be fun like that.

No, only strawman made-up gender politics is like that.

Re: CERN cuts ties with 'sexist' scientist Alessandro Strumia

#253

Post by dang »

mrjesus wrote: post #250
dang wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you please not post unsubstantive comments, and especially not snark or flamebait, to Hacker News? https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

How ironic. The whole "Einstein's Wife was the real genius" is an unsubstantiated claim. Everyone knows that the Ancient Aliens show is essentially begging the question. Much like like the OPs comment.

Since you don't seem to want to use this site as intended, we've banned the account.

If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future.

Re: CERN cuts ties with 'sexist' scientist Alessandro Strumia

#254

Post by obrisintor »

bhouston wrote: post #6

I am reminded of Larry Summers, then the head of Harvard, who said something similar: https://www.theguardian.com/science/2005/jan/18/educationsge... I think that previously there was a distinct issue with not enough women going through the degree programs. If the degree programs are 80% men and 20% women, statistically the men will outperform the women in outlier achievements just because there will likely be more p…

Your response makes a lot of sense. It is a shame that after people like Summers (or that Google guy) talk about these issues, the talks about how to attack whoever wrote the piece drowns out attacks on the idea. It may vary well be that your theory is right. In that case I would hope that the discourse would go as follows. Summers submits an article about how variance is the reasons for difference between men and women in careers. Then someone like you submits an article explaining why the first theory is incorrect. Then Summers explains why your critic is incorrect. After enough back and forth, other scientists in the field start to join the conversation, some agreeing with Summers other with you. After enough time the scientific consensus gravitates to one side.

However currently whenever someone talks about this, the response is not "let's argue your conclusion" but rather "burn the witch".

Re: CERN cuts ties with 'sexist' scientist Alessandro Strumia

#255

Post by fl0wenol »

patrickg_zill wrote: post #75

The skeptic in me asks: if he goes to a friend of his at CERN and asks him to present a talk that reaches the exact opposite conclusion, no matter how shaky the reasoning, will that person be similarly in danger of losing their position?

If he takes pot shots at colleagues by way of example during the presentation, then yes.

Re: CERN cuts ties with 'sexist' scientist Alessandro Strumia

#256

Post by petre »

mamon wrote: post #125
paganel wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This could go the other way, like you might be seen as saying that women don't have hand-spans as big as men, meaning that they're not as good as men when it comes to their physical capabilities and as such "providing" them with smaller pianos might be looked at as "demeaning" towards said women (you're thinking about them as not being as good as men are). Gender politics can be fun like that.

So producing shoes or coat's in women sizes is also "demeaning" towards women? I can't imagine why producing smaller pianos would be any different.

At least some companies (Meral - cycles Cyfac) are producing bicycles in women's sizes which are not just their male counterparts painted in pink and turqoise.

Re: CERN cuts ties with 'sexist' scientist Alessandro Strumia

#257

Post by pvg »

lawnchair_larry wrote: post #200
tptacek wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if you don't believe this (I think Jordan Peterson, who is fond of it, is a charlatan but not at all an anti-Semite), the term obviously occludes more than it clarifies, and was deliberately coined as a powerful negative emotional appeal; the choice to include it in a CERN physics workshop presentation is telling.

How can someone possibly call Jordan Peterson a charlatan? Are we redefining that word now too? Also, describing something as “telling” is a pretty strong signal that one lacks any substantive rebuttals but cannot resist throwing shade. It’s cheap.

Hang on, 'charlatan' is being 'redefined' merely by someone's opinion but the elaborated-upon use of 'telling', a word with a straightforward literal meaning, is fecund with secret malicious bias? It's hard hard to see how both of these can be true.

Re: CERN cuts ties with 'sexist' scientist Alessandro Strumia

#258

Post by saghm »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #89
jmole wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been reading recently about a structural/sociocultural/technological phenomenon that's actually holding women back in a field where women tend to dominate in representation at the academic level, but are regularly outcompeted by men at the professional level. Piano playing. It all comes down to the shape of the instrument, and hand-span, which is unquestionably (and uncontroversially) larger in men than in women…

> The other issue is that these pianos are hard to come by, since almost every manufacturer makes pianos of the same keyboard size, and pianists are one of the few musicians expected to play on whatever instrument they're given. This is a good point, but it seems to be determined by the fundamentals of pianos. Moving a piano is difficult enough that I wouldn't expect this to change. We could all switch to keyboards..…

I think that's probably why GP is interested in making 7/8 digital pianos (as seen in the "PS"), which are much more portable

Re: CERN cuts ties with 'sexist' scientist Alessandro Strumia

#259

Post by mrjesus »

dang wrote: post #253
mrjesus wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How ironic. The whole "Einstein's Wife was the real genius" is an unsubstantiated claim. Everyone knows that the Ancient Aliens show is essentially begging the question. Much like like the OPs comment.

Since you don't seem to want to use this site as intended, we've banned the account. If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future.

No your interpretation of the rules is just nonsense.

Re: CERN cuts ties with 'sexist' scientist Alessandro Strumia

#260

Post by BurningCycles »

davrosthedalek wrote: post #249
natrik wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn't an issue in the WNBA and Women's basketball in general where the ball is smaller than the men's ball.

Are they paid the same? Are they the same level of famous? I don't really watch basketball, but I don't think they are, and a "they are not as good as men" bias could very well be at play here.

The economics of sports are dominated by one factor, the size of the audience. If women started to watch female sports in anywhere near the numbers men watch male sports then the economics would change.

As it stands, women are just not as interested in watching sports as men are, with some exceptions like figure skating and gymnastics.

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