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Re-entry to US without backscatter or pat-down

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Re: Re-entry to US without backscatter or pat-down

#11

Post by chc »

ojbyrne wrote: post #8
Devilboy wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think he means on arrival in the US, not before you get on the plane.

I think his point is that some other countries don't take the latest TSA requirements seriously, and if you come from one of those countries, the TSA will screen you because of that.

I don't understand the point of that point. If the reason for the X-ray machines is to stop people from smuggling dangerous materials onto planes and using them to cause harm, scanning people after they get off the plane is the most literal analogue I've ever seen for shutting the barn door after the horses have fled.

Imagine a daycare center that had a policy of running background checks on its employees only once they quit. Would you feel like they were taking the children's safety very seriously?

Re: Re-entry to US without backscatter or pat-down

#12

Post by aneth »

If you look at the way this was handled it actually speaks to the professionalism of most of those involved. Regardless of your objection to the policy, which is not the decision of these people, the police and tsa seemed rational and accommodating.

Just think how this might have been handled in other countries.

Re: Re-entry to US without backscatter or pat-down

#13

Post by qeorge »

27182818284 wrote: post #7

Really lucky. That situation could have easily turned into a 6 hour detention regardless of legal rights (which are already being ignored)

That's the same threat the TSA agents make. Don't assert your rights or it'll be a huge pain in the ass.

Civil disobedience is not for the meek.

Re: Re-entry to US without backscatter or pat-down

#14

Post by dholowiski »

That's awesome.

Ever read Cory doctorow's "little brother"? That's what I think of every time I read one of these stories.

I've said it before- there are two easy ways to avoid this 1. Drive, 2. Don't visit the USA. To us residents, especially if you live in hawaii- sucks to be you!

Oh, and the rest of the world is laughing at you. Fix your flipping government.

Re: Re-entry to US without backscatter or pat-down

#15

Post by swombat »

acabal wrote: post #10

Oh wow, I had no idea they scan you after re-entering the country. I'm flying to Chicago O'Hare from London Gatwick on Dec 2, and now I'm concerned about this. Does anyone know precisely what my rights are as a US citizen upon re-entering the country to avoid all of this ridiculousness? I know that Customs has some Constitutional power for searches and so on (and there's that insane 100-mile "border" where people can…

Your mileage may vary, but it sounds to me like he was claiming his constitutional rights... "Am I being detained? Am I free to go?" seems to be a key-phrase of people who know their rights when faced with police officers. That, and verbally not consenting to any search - your person is also protected by constitutional rights, afaik. (note: I'm not American, I may be wrong)

Re: Re-entry to US without backscatter or pat-down

#16

Post by dpatru »

swombat wrote: post #9

In the 1500's a man called Étienne de la Boétie wrote, in a then-inflammatory "Discourse on Voluntary Servitude": Obviously there is no need of fighting to overcome this single tyrant, for he is automatically defeated if the country refuses consent to its own enslavement: it is not necessary to deprive him of anything, but simply to give him nothing; there is no need that the country make an effort to do anything for…

Fantastic quote. Thanks!

Re: Re-entry to US without backscatter or pat-down

#17

Post by morganpyne »

I find it appalling that US citizens are forced to such measures to enforce their rights and I'm glad that there are people both patient and stubborn enough to play out scenarios like this. However, as a non-US citizen I always wonder to myself when reading such stories if there are any international rights/laws that may be applicable when entering the States as a foreigner?

My understanding is that there are absolutely none, and I would have to submit to any and all egregious and invasive 'requests' (with NO limits) that are demanded of me in order to gain entry (which is why I haven't been there in a while and have no plans to go back). Does anybody have any information to the contrary?

Re: Re-entry to US without backscatter or pat-down

#19

Post by acabal »

swombat wrote: post #15
acabal wrote: post #10

Oh wow, I had no idea they scan you after re-entering the country. I'm flying to Chicago O'Hare from London Gatwick on Dec 2, and now I'm concerned about this. Does anyone know precisely what my rights are as a US citizen upon re-entering the country to avoid all of this ridiculousness? I know that Customs has some Constitutional power for searches and so on (and there's that insane 100-mile "border" where people can…

Your mileage may vary, but it sounds to me like he was claiming his constitutional rights... "Am I being detained? Am I free to go?" seems to be a key-phrase of people who know their rights when faced with police officers. That, and verbally not consenting to any search - your person is also protected by constitutional rights, afaik. (note: I'm not American, I may be wrong)

I think that Customs may detain you at a border--they have more leeway in the Constitution for border searches iirc. That's what I'm confused about now, because with each new insane agency that gets created and each new law that alters and amends old law, it's hard for a non-lawyer to get a clear picture of exactly what is and what isn't a right.

And if I have the free time upon landing and no flight to catch, I don't want to give TSA an inch.

Edit: here's the Wikipedia article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Border_search_exception

It says that "reasonable" searches, i.e. property searches, can be conducted without warrant by Customs officers at the border. "Unreasonable" searches like x-ray, pat-downs, and strip searches require a warrant. But is TSA allowed to do this as well, or only Customs agents?

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