How badly are we being ripped off on eyewear? Former industry execs tell all • Hacker News Board

Re: How badly are we being ripped off on eyewear? Former industry execs tell all

#191

Post by badpun » Tue, Mar 05, 2019, 8:33 PM UTC

eeeeeeeeeeeee wrote: post #74

sampo wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> how much of our middle class burden comes from hidden rent seeking parasites like this. If you include the unwillingness to respond to demand by building enough new homes in the popular urban areas, probably a lot. A 1000 sq.ft. home (house or condo) should not cost more than $200,000 to build. Anything above that, someone is making profit.

It doesn't even seem like anyone has interest in building $200,000 houses anymore, but they will sell you a poorly made condo for $400,000 and $600/mo HOA fees. I am a single person trying to find a house that is not four or five bedrooms (I only need one or two) and doesn't cost 1/2 mil minimum and it's difficult. This used to be called "the starter house" but it doesn't seem to exist anymore with new construction.

In my country (Poland), the majority of people who are interested in buying a house just buy the lot and contract a company to build the house for them. This way, you get to live in a house that's exactly right for you. Of course, the flip side is that the whole process takes a year or longer - but here most people live in flats, and those who decide (and can afford) to own a house, treat it as a part of settling in the area for a longer period of time.

Re: How badly are we being ripped off on eyewear? Former industry execs tell all

#192

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Mar 05, 2019, 8:37 PM UTC

tasty_freeze wrote: post #188

I don't get it. I just tried a few online "cheap glasses" places. I want single vision, prescription (relatively low strength, nothing exotic), polarized sunglasses. Fashion doesn't really matter, it is just for driving. zenni: $25 frames, cheapest polarization option: $67.89 eyebuydirect.com: $42 frames (malibu), plus polarization: $92 39dollarglasses.com: $39 frames (houston), cheapest polarization option +69, tota…

[deleted]

Re: How badly are we being ripped off on eyewear? Former industry execs tell all

#193

Post by seem_2211 » Tue, Mar 05, 2019, 8:37 PM UTC

jerf wrote: post #27

It's articles like this that make me wonder how much of our middle class burden comes from hidden rent seeking parasites like this. I honestly don't know. I'm not trying to imply any particular thing. I honestly wonder. These sorts of things can stack up through the layers of companies that make things. And where does this money go? What does it end up doing?

I think there are a few interesting wrinkles with regards to rent seeking in the current economy and how that works out for the middle class.

• As a few people have pointed out, people often buy sunglasses for fashion and social signaling rather than on price. Wearing Tom Ford glasses means you're getting very good quality glasses, but mostly you are paying to wear Tom Ford glasses, in the same way that a Rolls Royce and a mid level BMW are functionally very similar, even though there is a 5x difference in price (if not a higher change). You're paying for the styling and the brand name.

• Where the money goes: for a lot of consumer brands, huge sums go into brand advertising. B2B companies spend this money on salespeople and tradeshows. I like to give the example of a Rolex. A new Rolex is worth $10-15k (if not more) because they spend tens of millions of dollars every year telling us all that that's why they're worth so much. Compare that to a lesser advertised brand - say Tag Heuer, and you'll see there's a pretty big difference in their pricing. Traditionally this money has gone into magazines / billboards / tv commercials / sports sponsorship - so this money is subsidizing middle class entertainment. On the B2B side, if you engage with a company like SAP, you'll get a professional sales team walking you through the buying process (they'll probably even spot you a few nice dinners along the way).

• "Rent seeking" is an interesting term, and while I agree with it in the context of sunglasses, it's a bit hard to nail down in a lot of the economy. Price is funny because lots of the things we produce now (particularly software, pharmaceuticals & entertainment) have revenue models that don't see much of an increase in marginal cost once you've covered the initial investment (10k people see your movie in cinemas vs 1m - provided you've got the infrastructure in place, it's not like the price of producing the movie goes up 100x).

• The culprits for the "middle class burden" is often pointed at healthcare and higher education for the simple reason that they have dramatically increased administrative costs which ultimately haven't added much (if any) value to the consumer (people argue my first point with regards to higher education - perhaps a Harvard education is worth $60k a year, although it's hard to see many other colleges worth that much for the brand alone).

Re: How badly are we being ripped off on eyewear? Former industry execs tell all

#194

Post by ukyrgf » Tue, Mar 05, 2019, 8:39 PM UTC

ericmcer wrote: post #78

Can anyone speak to why you need an up to date prescription to buy glasses or contacts? It has never made an ounce of sense to me, yet I have been blocked from doing it in the past, gone through the rigamarole to find out my prescription is unchanged, and then bought them.

You can walk into Walmart right now and buy reading glasses over the counter. I can type in random numbers on a dozen sites and get glasses made to spec.

Contact lenses are regulated by the FDA.

Re: How badly are we being ripped off on eyewear? Former industry execs tell all

#195

Post by 1996 » Tue, Mar 05, 2019, 8:43 PM UTC

caymanjim wrote: post #43

Lens Crafters charges a huge markup if you want their lenses put into your own frames. It's almost cheaper to buy new frames from them (and in the case of particularly-expensive lenses, it is in fact cheaper to buy new frames). That's clearly a scam. Warby Parker sells glasses at more reasonable prices, but their frames are god-awful hideous tortoiseshell plastic abominations. If you want nice metal frames, they have…

> one for distance, one computer-specific

How do you find the correction for the computer specific glass?

I have a pair for distance but it is a horror to use with computers.

Re: How badly are we being ripped off on eyewear? Former industry execs tell all

#196

Post by anewguy9000 » Tue, Mar 05, 2019, 8:44 PM UTC

wait we should be paying costs and not a markup? thats communism

Re: How badly are we being ripped off on eyewear? Former industry execs tell all

#197

Post by chown » Tue, Mar 05, 2019, 8:45 PM UTC

Recently, I was telling a friend how ridiculously cheap it is to buy a pair of glasses overseas. I paid about $22 for the pair I'm wearing. I went to make an extra pair recently (a backup pair, just in case). They quoted me about $450, which they agreed, was of lesser quality than the one I was wearing. Blew my mind! I then decided to just get it shipped from the same place I got my first pair. They couldn't ship it so my sister has to do it. Ended up costing me about $40 with shipping.

Re: How badly are we being ripped off on eyewear? Former industry execs tell all

#198

Post by mthoms » Tue, Mar 05, 2019, 8:46 PM UTC

forthispurpose wrote: post #17

What are some good online companies that are fighting this status quo?

Clearly.ca in Canada is doing a decent job. They have quite a few in-house brands and stock store fronts in major metro areas for trying on frames.

Re: How badly are we being ripped off on eyewear? Former industry execs tell all

#199

Post by qes » Tue, Mar 05, 2019, 8:48 PM UTC

eeeeeeeeeeeee wrote: post #74

sampo wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> how much of our middle class burden comes from hidden rent seeking parasites like this. If you include the unwillingness to respond to demand by building enough new homes in the popular urban areas, probably a lot. A 1000 sq.ft. home (house or condo) should not cost more than $200,000 to build. Anything above that, someone is making profit.

It doesn't even seem like anyone has interest in building $200,000 houses anymore, but they will sell you a poorly made condo for $400,000 and $600/mo HOA fees. I am a single person trying to find a house that is not four or five bedrooms (I only need one or two) and doesn't cost 1/2 mil minimum and it's difficult. This used to be called "the starter house" but it doesn't seem to exist anymore with new construction.

I've always considered "new construction" and "starter house" mutually exclusive.

Re: How badly are we being ripped off on eyewear? Former industry execs tell all

#200

Post by 1996 » Tue, Mar 05, 2019, 8:49 PM UTC

pedasmith wrote: post #62

I dipped my toe into the "online glasses" market -- and let me say it's a game-changer. The eyeglass store wanted about $300 per frame, meaning that I'd grudgingly get one pair. The online purchase was only $75 for high-end frames and coatings, plus $27 for three pairs of prescription "computer monitor" glasses (one for the office, one for the home office, one for the other home office!). And by having more pairs, I…

> $27 for three pairs of prescription "computer monitor" glasses

You are the second person to mention "computer monitor" glasses so I wonder, are they the same correction as your normal glasses? I am new to wearing glasses. I have a pair I use outside, they make everything crystal clear. I love them!! But for computers they are a pain after while, so I don't use them.

As other people mention costs, I paid about $30 total for the eye exam + frame + both lenses + next day delivery (not in the US).

Now I am in the US for a while, so I can't ask for "computer monitor" glasses, but with my correction information I could try to order some from zenni or eyebuydirect.