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Why American Construction Costs Are So High

pedestrianobservations.com

11–20 of 164 posts

Re: Why American Construction Costs Are So High

#11
News that the Transbay Terminal is something like $300 million over budget should not come as a shock to anyone. We always knew the initial estimate was way under the real cost. Just like we never had a real cost for the Central Subway or the Bay Bridge or any other massive construction project. So get off it. In the world of civic projects, the first budget is really just a down payment. If people knew the real cost from the start, nothing would ever be approved. The idea is to get going. Start digging a hole and make it so big, there’s no alternative to coming up with the money to fill it in. - Willie Brown (former SF mayor)

I think the inability of politicians to have a real conversation about costs is a big part of high construction costs. Without this sort of difficult conversation it's hard to plan and try to mitigate things that might cause ballooning costs because you need to pretend that don't exist in the first case.

Re: Why American Construction Costs Are So High

#12
One of my first jobs in IT was for a big general contractor.

We built schools, hotels, restaurants, you name it.

Whenever we had a government project, like a building for the county, a jail, new secretary of state/dmv office...we went way over budget and way over schedule. EVERY. SINGLE. TIME.

We'd have a 'groundbreaking ceremony' and then not be able to actually dig at the site for 12 more days because permits got tripped up. How can the government not approve their own permits on time?

Re: Why American Construction Costs Are So High

#13
I haven’t had time to read through the entire article in detail but my skimming indicates that the article fails to identify what I believe is the true reason for tunneling increases in the USA: third parties and their ability to sue projects.

This increases costs due to risk of lawsuits/challenges and excessive amounts of money put towards mitigating this risk. This continues from procurement through design and through construction. Environmental concerns have ironically been coopted into this category by NIMBY folks.

Re: Why American Construction Costs Are So High

#15

Funny that the article doesn't once mention unions as a factor that drives up cost. It's almost as if attacks on unions for making public works slow and expensive are disingenuous.

Indeed, the author even wrote another article explicitly refuting the anti-union argument. https://pedestrianobservations.com/2019/01/08/meme-weeding-u...

It's an interesting refutation. The author explicitly claims the following:

1. Construction unions in New York, specifically, cause horrific and unjustifiable cost increases.

2. But unions in most of the country aren't in New York, and don't have the same power that NY unions do.

3. The problem is that New York is responsible for a lot of construction, and more sensible areas unthinkingly copy New York's awful, union-driven policies -- those other areas don't need to do things New York's way, but they don't have enough construction experience to know better.

The author goes on to say that union-busting politics as they exist in the US won't solve the problem, but obviously believes that unions are responsible for significant parts of it. (And in fact says in so many words that in the absence of particularized US politics, union-busting would be somewhere from neutral to productive.)

An immediate implication is that if you're worried about getting things built in New York, you should be trying to break up the unions there.

Re: Why American Construction Costs Are So High

#16

News that the Transbay Terminal is something like $300 million over budget should not come as a shock to anyone. We always knew the initial estimate was way under the real cost. Just like we never had a real cost for the Central Subway or the Bay Bridge or any other massive construction project. So get off it. In the world of civic projects, the first budget is really just a down payment. If people knew the real cost…

The politicians can’t have a real conversation about costs because the legal and political complexity of our society has reached such high levels that it is impossible to accurately project costs multiple years into the future.

Re: Why American Construction Costs Are So High

#17

One of my first jobs in IT was for a big general contractor. We built schools, hotels, restaurants, you name it. Whenever we had a government project, like a building for the county, a jail, new secretary of state/dmv office...we went way over budget and way over schedule. EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. We'd have a 'groundbreaking ceremony' and then not be able to actually dig at the site for 12 more days because permits got t…

>How can the government not approve their own permits on time?

I'd wager that "internal customers" aren't buying donuts to accompany their permits and doing all the other borderline corruption type things you need to do in order to get government do work with you in a timely manner.

Edit: Having the person at the desk remember your company as "the one that brings donuts" and the mid-level manager remembering your company as "the one that sponsored my son's little league team" don't has the potential to make a massive difference. For a company that does a lot of business with government spending a few grand a year making sure the people of government see you in a positive light is well worth it.

Re: Why American Construction Costs Are So High

#18
The point about the size of the stations is very obvious in Chicago. Most of the stations were built 100 years ago, and are roughly the same size. A handful of stations have been rebuilt--at great cost. At some of the older stations, you can't barely walk 2 people side by side on the platform without feeling like you're about to fall on to the tracks. The new stations by comparison are 4 times as wide and have gigantic entrances.

Re: Why American Construction Costs Are So High

#19
post #13

I haven’t had time to read through the entire article in detail but my skimming indicates that the article fails to identify what I believe is the true reason for tunneling increases in the USA: third parties and their ability to sue projects. This increases costs due to risk of lawsuits/challenges and excessive amounts of money put towards mitigating this risk. This continues from procurement through design and thro…

Also just as a point on High Speed Rail: this job was put out to bid and awarded before the owner had secured property access for the contractor (Tutor) and Tutor sought damages for this legitimate delay. Shame on Tutor for being good at playing the game that California has set up I guess?

Re: Why American Construction Costs Are So High

#20
post #13

I haven’t had time to read through the entire article in detail but my skimming indicates that the article fails to identify what I believe is the true reason for tunneling increases in the USA: third parties and their ability to sue projects. This increases costs due to risk of lawsuits/challenges and excessive amounts of money put towards mitigating this risk. This continues from procurement through design and thro…

> the article fails to identify what I believe is the true reason for tunneling increases in the USA: third parties and their ability to sue projects

Why do you believe that's the true reason? I have no idea if it is or if it isn't, I'm just wondering where you got that from.

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