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Let’s Destroy Robocalls

nytimes.com

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Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#141

Post by Evidlo »

penagwin wrote: post #130
Loughla wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So shift the burden of calling to literally everyone who is acting well? Why would I want to remember a unique PIN for everyone I know? Also, isn't that just taking the 9 digit phone number and turning it into a 12 digit?

Plus how would we share this "pin"? Maybe we could append it to the phone number, like "+1 (616) 281 - 2123#32343" - Oh wait, it's already a number, what's the point of adding more onto it? It would literally turn into the same system that we have, as you have to share the pin with everyone anyway.

It's different because then not every "number" will result in a call being placed. Determining whether a number is valid requires making a call, which ties up robocallers.

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#142

Post by egypturnash »

cletus wrote: post #62

So robocalls are the result of: - Cost of phone calls decreasing to basically zero - Cost of automation going to basically zero - Phone calls that can come from the Internet so there are no national boundaries anymore - Caller ID operating on essentially the honor system - Bad actors (telephone companies) benefitting from this traffic by charging for it - Larger players having no incentive to punish bad actors There'…

Contacts-only whitelist with some work:

Default ring: silence, no vibration. Custom ringtone for everyone you actually want to pick up the phone and talk to. Yeah you gotta spend some time setting it up for your existing contacts, then spend 5s selecting a ring when you add a new contact.

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#143

Post by WorldMaker »

mrguyorama wrote: post #80
WorldMaker wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been saying for a while that Phone UX on our handheld computers is an amazing mistake. There's no other application on any computing device that we allow to be an uneasily dismissable, focus stealing modal with sound alarms in 2019. Sure, phone calls have historical weight behind them, but it is past time to rethink the UX for current usage.

If you want to see how good UX can be on a mobile device, download Microsoft Remote Desktop for android and remote into a Microsoft Windows Server instance. I just want that experience, though preferably with a Linux system, that happens to have a "phone" application. Did anyone ever make a "desktop" phone?

Microsoft Lumia 950 got incredibly close to being a "desktop" phone. Continuum was ahead of the curve. It was really cool being able to Miracast to any capable screen and expand the phone out onto a larger screen, even if you still only had access to "mobile" apps on that larger screen, most just worked fine. Add a Bluetooth keyboard and mouse for even more of a "desktop phone" experience.

The interesting part too is right now people are playing with Windows 10 on ARM on the Lumia 950 hardware (which is supposed to be a generation too old in ARM processor, but seems in practice to work just fine). The latest Windows 10 on ARM builds have x86 emulation and Win32 support and suddenly you also have access to 32-bit Windows apps going back forever on the device. (One video has someone load up even Steam and Fallout 1 on that hardware.) So they truly are "desktop" phones today, just maybe too late for that to be useful to phone market.

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#144

Post by bloopernova »

nonbel wrote: post #82
cletus wrote: post #62

So robocalls are the result of: - Cost of phone calls decreasing to basically zero - Cost of automation going to basically zero - Phone calls that can come from the Internet so there are no national boundaries anymore - Caller ID operating on essentially the honor system - Bad actors (telephone companies) benefitting from this traffic by charging for it - Larger players having no incentive to punish bad actors There'…

It never made much sense to me that the providers would not offer some kind of robocall-free plan. I would instantly switch to avoid getting any more of these spoofed calls, which would block the vast majority of robocalls. It turns out that it is government regulation somehow preventing this: > "The FCC last year authorized voice service providers to block more types of calls in which the Caller ID has been spoofed…

I pay t-mobile $4/month for their advanced spam-call blocking feature, and it works very well. I now get maybe 1 spam call every 2 weeks, compared against my worthless work number that has no such blocking which gets maybe 6 spam calls a day.

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#145

Post by rootusrootus »

As someone who used to work for a telco, please be aware that they could solve this at any time. They choose not to. I wonder if they have a secret list, though, of numbers that should never get robocalls. Aka congressmen.

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#146

Post by bryondowd »

dfxm12 wrote: post #91
acdha wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What confuses me about this is that Apple could solve this in two seconds by allowing contact whitelists where only incoming calls in your contacts are accepted and everything else is sent to voicemail or dropped. Now you missed the reminder from your dentist, a call from that relative whose new number you forgot to save, and you have 600 recruiters and other stale business contacts in your address book because you…

Now you missed the reminder from your dentist, a call from that relative whose new number you forgot to save These are the types of people who leave voicemails. Robocallers are not...

In my experience, the robocallers are more likely to leave voicemail. You just get the first 10 seconds of their recording chopped off and the rest in your mailbox. So now you've just moved your issue from live calls to having to check your mailbox periodically to see if there's anything important mixed with the spam. Plus the added possibility that a legit caller doesn't leave a message, and something important gets delayed due to an inability to contact you.

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#147

Post by tamaharbor »

whatislovecraft wrote: post #38
bovermyer wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You must not talk to many Republicans.

I sure don't. I'd like to, but most Republicans seem to want me to die. They vote out the very existence of people like me, denying our right to safety and to live as freely and openly as they do. So it's quite scary, talking in person with people who encourage me to commit suicide based on my beliefs or identity, and even pass laws that seem to serve no purpose but to cause pain to others. I'll be here to talk to Re…

Quite the chip on your shoulder. I feel sorry for you.

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#148

Post by jerrysievert »

wnevets wrote: post #37

Google voice seems to do a great job filtering out the spam. I can't remember the last time I got one with my voice number.

interesting. my robocall numbers dropped significantly when I stopped forwarding my google voice number to my phone. I still get the voicemails, missed call list, and texts when I log in to the voice portal, and get to see what I missed - they just aren't going to my phone anymore.

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#149

Post by devcpp »

zackmorris wrote: post #131
cletus wrote: post #62

So robocalls are the result of: - Cost of phone calls decreasing to basically zero - Cost of automation going to basically zero - Phone calls that can come from the Internet so there are no national boundaries anymore - Caller ID operating on essentially the honor system - Bad actors (telephone companies) benefitting from this traffic by charging for it - Larger players having no incentive to punish bad actors There'…

Since caller id was implemented so poorly: https://www.onsip.com/blog/how-caller-id-works-why-it-might-... Maybe it would be nice if we had something kind of like a CAPTCHA, where an app on your phone would say "please dial and say your name to complete your call" and the person would have to dial it and say who they are to talk to you. Totally knee-jerk idea I realize, but I literally get 10 SCAM LIKELY calls for ev…

It's insanely easy for a program to recognize individual digits and then type them out. Saying a name would also be trivial (recorded, generated, etc). Audio captchas have existed for a while, they have been an alternative for a long time, and they are even more annoying than images.

What we need is an abuse prevention system involving authentication. You can get reported for robo calls, and if enough different accounts you called have reported you, you get reviewed/banned/throttled. Let's not reinvent the wheel, it's been the standard way to deal with spam all over the web. But it requires rethinking the way we use phones, and a whole new infrastructure. It also brings some anonymity concerns but half-measures are just an arms race.

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#150

Post by Someone1234 »

egypturnash wrote: post #142
cletus wrote: post #62

So robocalls are the result of: - Cost of phone calls decreasing to basically zero - Cost of automation going to basically zero - Phone calls that can come from the Internet so there are no national boundaries anymore - Caller ID operating on essentially the honor system - Bad actors (telephone companies) benefitting from this traffic by charging for it - Larger players having no incentive to punish bad actors There'…

Contacts-only whitelist with some work: Default ring: silence, no vibration. Custom ringtone for everyone you actually want to pick up the phone and talk to. Yeah you gotta spend some time setting it up for your existing contacts, then spend 5s selecting a ring when you add a new contact.

This seems like an iOS specific work-around.

On other platforms they simply give you the choice to block non-contact calls. I can do so on my Pixel by leaving Do-Not-Disturb on with Contacts Only.

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