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Gender pay gap shrinks when companies disclose wages

news.cornell.edu

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Re: Gender pay gap shrinks when companies disclose wages

#31

Post by marvin »

gherig4 wrote: post #8
xfitm3 wrote: post #2

I found this to be really interesting: "The researchers were especially surprised by the way in which the companies adapted to the regulation – by slowing the growth of men’s wages, not increasing women’s."

I experienced this first hand and as a result I departed for greener pastures. Isn't diversity a great thing when it suppresses wages, no wonder all the big boys are pushing for it.

This is happening at my place right now. Leadership has dictated that priority is now to even out gender imbalances rather than giving raises. Since the women in our company are heavily skewed towards lower-paying roles (QA, customer support), this means the company will avoid giving raises to the roles that actually are in demand and have strong salary growth elsewhere. Needless to say, those of us with options have started looking.

Of course, everyone who gets a competitive offer elsewhere will get a counteroffer, so this policy only applies where it’s convenient.

Re: Gender pay gap shrinks when companies disclose wages

#32

Post by dmichulke »

ve55 wrote: post #25

>From 2003 to 2008, the gender pay gap at the reporting companies shrank 7 percent, from 18.9 percent down to 17.5 percent Is this really a large enough effect size to justify such a headline? >Our findings suggest that regulatory mandates on pay transparency, as a means to overcome biases against women in the workforce, may be effective in closing the gender pay gap. No, they really do not. A potential reduction fro…

I once read an interesting thought experiment about this, adapted to this story it goes like this:

We assume:

- Greedy capitalist bosses (wanting to pay less for more work)

- Same productivity of men and women

Now if there's an 18.9% pay gap, then women are on average 18.9% cheaper to employ than men.

Greedy capitalist bosses should therefore only employ women, closing the gender pay gap by driving womens' wages higher (and those of men lower).

Yet this doesn't happen, so one of the assumptions is wrong or the gender pay gap difference (the 18.9%) is not correct.

Re: Gender pay gap shrinks when companies disclose wages

#33

Post by adrianN »

dmichulke wrote: post #32
ve55 wrote: post #25

>From 2003 to 2008, the gender pay gap at the reporting companies shrank 7 percent, from 18.9 percent down to 17.5 percent Is this really a large enough effect size to justify such a headline? >Our findings suggest that regulatory mandates on pay transparency, as a means to overcome biases against women in the workforce, may be effective in closing the gender pay gap. No, they really do not. A potential reduction fro…

I once read an interesting thought experiment about this, adapted to this story it goes like this: We assume: - Greedy capitalist bosses (wanting to pay less for more work) - Same productivity of men and women Now if there's an 18.9% pay gap, then women are on average 18.9% cheaper to employ than men. Greedy capitalist bosses should therefore only employ women, closing the gender pay gap by driving womens' wages high…

Another assumption that could be wrong is that greedy bosses can accurately determine productivity. If bosses have biases that cause them to underevaluate women's productivity this would also explain the pay difference.

Re: Gender pay gap shrinks when companies disclose wages

#36

Post by dmichulke »

adrianN wrote: post #33
dmichulke wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I once read an interesting thought experiment about this, adapted to this story it goes like this: We assume: - Greedy capitalist bosses (wanting to pay less for more work) - Same productivity of men and women Now if there's an 18.9% pay gap, then women are on average 18.9% cheaper to employ than men. Greedy capitalist bosses should therefore only employ women, closing the gender pay gap by driving womens' wages high…

Another assumption that could be wrong is that greedy bosses can accurately determine productivity. If bosses have biases that cause them to underevaluate women's productivity this would also explain the pay difference.

Not sure.

Even if you had only 1 out of 10 bosses able to determine productivity, that guy'd only employ women, so he'd cover some of the "losses" of the other 9 bosses.

Also, you'd probably see a bimodal pay gap distribution per company.

Re: Gender pay gap shrinks when companies disclose wages

#37

Post by coldtea »

dmichulke wrote: post #32
ve55 wrote: post #25

>From 2003 to 2008, the gender pay gap at the reporting companies shrank 7 percent, from 18.9 percent down to 17.5 percent Is this really a large enough effect size to justify such a headline? >Our findings suggest that regulatory mandates on pay transparency, as a means to overcome biases against women in the workforce, may be effective in closing the gender pay gap. No, they really do not. A potential reduction fro…

I once read an interesting thought experiment about this, adapted to this story it goes like this: We assume: - Greedy capitalist bosses (wanting to pay less for more work) - Same productivity of men and women Now if there's an 18.9% pay gap, then women are on average 18.9% cheaper to employ than men. Greedy capitalist bosses should therefore only employ women, closing the gender pay gap by driving womens' wages high…

>- Greedy capitalist bosses (wanting to pay less for more work)

Well, that, for one, is a given.

Re: Gender pay gap shrinks when companies disclose wages

#38

Post by coldtea »

adrianN wrote: post #33
dmichulke wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I once read an interesting thought experiment about this, adapted to this story it goes like this: We assume: - Greedy capitalist bosses (wanting to pay less for more work) - Same productivity of men and women Now if there's an 18.9% pay gap, then women are on average 18.9% cheaper to employ than men. Greedy capitalist bosses should therefore only employ women, closing the gender pay gap by driving womens' wages high…

Another assumption that could be wrong is that greedy bosses can accurately determine productivity. If bosses have biases that cause them to underevaluate women's productivity this would also explain the pay difference.

That would still give a huge benefit to the greedy boss who can "accurately determine productivity" and hires all women for cheaper, which means it would inevitably be copied in the end.

Re: Gender pay gap shrinks when companies disclose wages

#39

Post by coldtea »

ganzuul wrote: post #30
zdragnar wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like a given outcome, to me. Suppose that half of your workforce makes 60% of the wages, and the other half make 40%. Suddenly, PR dictates that you need to even that out. Your budget for salaries hasn't increased. Your other costs haven't decreased. Your projected revenues haven't increased. The money to bump the bottom half up has to come from somewhere, and with a fixed salary budget, it comes from the ot…

Seems like a self-fulfilling prophecy in that scenario. Equal wages is supposed to result in improved production... isn't it?

>Equal wages is supposed to result in improved production... isn't it?

No, why would they?

Re: Gender pay gap shrinks when companies disclose wages

#40

Post by pjc50 »

dmichulke wrote: post #32
ve55 wrote: post #25

>From 2003 to 2008, the gender pay gap at the reporting companies shrank 7 percent, from 18.9 percent down to 17.5 percent Is this really a large enough effect size to justify such a headline? >Our findings suggest that regulatory mandates on pay transparency, as a means to overcome biases against women in the workforce, may be effective in closing the gender pay gap. No, they really do not. A potential reduction fro…

I once read an interesting thought experiment about this, adapted to this story it goes like this: We assume: - Greedy capitalist bosses (wanting to pay less for more work) - Same productivity of men and women Now if there's an 18.9% pay gap, then women are on average 18.9% cheaper to employ than men. Greedy capitalist bosses should therefore only employ women, closing the gender pay gap by driving womens' wages high…

In any organisation it's only the owners who are ultimately concerned with overall cost - managers can have all sorts of incentives for larger or less efficient staff.
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