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Intellectual Denial of Service Attacks

techiavellian.com

11–20 of 107 posts

Re: Intellectual Denial of Service Attacks

#11
post #2

So true and a great way to think of it. I moved to weighing the benefits of proving someone wrong vs. ignoring and nodding. Will help to reduce the number of arguments you get into and make room for the important ones.

I realised a while ago that I was spending way too much time and energy getting into pointless online arguments about social justice issues. I now have a pretty low threshold of disagreement above which I'll immediately (and politely) disengage, and if it escalates at all from there, just block the person. I no longer care if someone is wrong on the internet, it's not my job to re-educate them, and the less energy I waste on them the better.

Re: Intellectual Denial of Service Attacks

#12

See also the Gish Gallop - a debating technique named after the creationist Duane Gish, which involves making as many specious arguments as quickly as possible. An unprepared opponent is likely to be overwhelmed by the sheer number of points they need to refute. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gish_gallop A variant of this technique is now standard in competitive debating, creating a truly absurd spectacle; most teams…

> A variant of this technique is now standard in competitive debating

I think the reason for this is that there's a rule (possibly unwritten?) that if you drop an argument you automatically concede it. So it's in your best interest to belt out as many points as you possibly can and hope your opponent can't respond to all of them.

Re: Intellectual Denial of Service Attacks

#13

See also the Gish Gallop - a debating technique named after the creationist Duane Gish, which involves making as many specious arguments as quickly as possible. An unprepared opponent is likely to be overwhelmed by the sheer number of points they need to refute. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gish_gallop A variant of this technique is now standard in competitive debating, creating a truly absurd spectacle; most teams…

> A variant of this technique is now standard in competitive debating

Not outside the US it isn’t. Policy debating is a special US abomination, with unfortunate extensions into the cultural colony to the north. Everywhere else does parliamentary debating.

Re: Intellectual Denial of Service Attacks

#16

I would have expected the article to say something about election meddling via social media. Citizens are denied access to true information by drowning it in fake news.

They aren't denied access to it, they just have to pay attention and be discerning if they want to filter all that information for the truth. The problem today is, there are fewer and fewer people who are trying to inform instead of persuade.

Re: Intellectual Denial of Service Attacks

#17
I think the worst kind of intellectual DOS attacks are those with high compression rate. Those that sound vaguely plausible at first ("Just do away with ALL the taxes, people will sort it out and enterprise will skyrocket") but require many more words to refute. When the politician in question is also a fast talker, and has a master's degree in Philosophy, he can appear to be smarter because no one can keep up with him and it's by definition impossible to refute all compressed arguments in the same amount of time. A Polish politician I have in mind goes by initials JKM.

My point: an intelligent, educated person can cross over to the dark side and it makes it all the way worse. Some people praise Dan Brown for his intelligence. So what, he doesn't write books for intelligent people.

In the past, centralized media kinda kept those guys in check because it had higher respect for formal education. The "compressed argument" still worked very well for populists in space-constrained media like TV debates (time) and print (word limit). Now, the Pandora's box is open.

To succeed in social media, you don't need to construct good arguments. Some charisma and a way with words will go a looong way. Ordinary people no longer seem to respect education, logic and wisdom. This is a problem because no one can be an expert at everything. In the end, we trust some people. What if a lot of people put trust not into expertise and experience, but into charismatic, cheeky figures? What if they prefer appeals to nationality, bloodline (son of a heroic activist)?

Is there a strategy that works against populism and isn't intellectually dishonest?

Re: Intellectual Denial of Service Attacks

#18
Jonathan Swift in 1710:

"Falsehood flies, and truth comes limping after it, so that when men come to be undeceived, it is too late; the jest is over, and the tale hath had its effect: like a man, who hath thought of a good repartee when the discourse is changed, or the company parted; or like a physician, who hath found out an infallible medicine, after the patient is dead."

Re: Intellectual Denial of Service Attacks

#19

That quote on the slide is the Bullshit Asymmetry Principle: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bullshit#Bullshit_asymmetry_...

There’s a very similar saying in my native language (Romanian) that roughly translates into English like this:

> One fool person throws a rock into a lake and ten smart persons then try their best to get it out

Re: Intellectual Denial of Service Attacks

#20
Bored with people bagging Flat Earthers, we get it you're smarter.

This is a self inflicted DoS

Flat earthers are no different to 6000 years-ers (Or religion in general). Science goes on.

Issues with replication in science is a real issue.

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