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This Is Silicon Valley

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171–180 of 227 posts

Re: This Is Silicon Valley

#171

I'm gonna offer a slightly different perspective: SV isn't that nice, and it's not worth the price premium. There is a distinct lack of culture, of nightlife, of arts and humanities - even in San Francisco. We're a mediocre land of strip malls and suburbs masquerading as an international destination. Go to any other city and tell me that it's not MORE vibrant (Chicago, LA, NYC, Miami, Austin, Portland, Seattle, Houst…

Fair enough. Keep in mind, the appeal of San Francisco before all of this happened wasn't that it is vibrant. Different cities can appeal for different reasons.

San Francisco, when people spoke of it affectionately, was the cool grey city of love. It wasn't only that, or always as good as that, but that was the appeal. The appeal of San Francisco is that it was an urban place with a notably less frenetic vibe. I'd also say that San Francisco is actually considerably more urban than almost every other city outside NY in the United States, even though, somewhat paradoxically, it has less of the urban vibrancy you describe.

Here's a link to some urban density maps from a discussion forum.

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=204523

The first thing you'll see is that in the US, it's New York and everywhere else. But of everywhere else, San Francisco has notably more widespread high urban density than the other US cities you mentioned. It's enough that you actually can live that life in SF, even if it is somewhat limited.

This appealed to a lot of people. It actually still does - or would, if people could afford it. Something odd happened to San Francisco. I grew up here in the 70s and 80s, and San Francisco wasn't ever really known as an alpha city for a career. Living here was a softer version of living in, say, New Orleans. Nobody says "I hate living in New Orleans, but I have to be here because of the amazing career options in finance/tech/entertainment." It's not that you can't pursue a profession with ambition in New Orleans, but the main reason people who make the choice to live in New Orleans do so, in spite the problems, is that they love New Orleans.

So it goes, or went, for San Francisco - though San Francisco was a strong beta-plus, perhaps even alpha minus, city for careers. As late as the mid 90s, parents in SF were encouraging the younger set to consider leaving SF for career options, considering SF to be somewhat limited for career advancement. I explained to them, at the time, that tech really was bigger here...

Wow have things changed. Gayle Laackman McDowell wrote a post:

http://www.gayle.com/blog/2015/11/if-you-want-an-a-career-in...

It's hard to explain how unlike the San Francisco I grew up in this post really is. It is the opposite of how SF perceived itself. SF was where you lived because you liked it so much here that you were willing to give up on the career options available in New York, London, even Chicago or Los Angeles. The idea that SF is something you put up with for the career options, but leave if you want an alpha minus career but a better quality of life, is a 180 degree change, and it happened with light speed.

I think this accounts for a lot of the "10 reasons why I hate SF" posts of the lament about SF you see on places like HN so often. Until quite recently, you wouldn't have seen a post on why people like NY so much better than SF that because person would't be living in SF. They'd visit for a conference, say "huh, things sure close early here", and go back home to NY. Any sort of complaining about needing to live here for career advancement would have met with general puzzlement. Even tech, which was bigger here, but not nearly as big a deal as it is now, and mainly concentrated in the South Bay anyway.

I get it, you hate SF but choose to live here because you put career above living in a city you enjoy - a tradeoff that came into existence so quickly it has a lot of long time San Franciscans blinking like deer in the headlights. And SF has largely lost the qualities that people enjoyed about it, even though it sounds like those are qualities you wouldn't have valued much anyway.

Re: This Is Silicon Valley

#172

>I just started working at Google and it wasn't everything I had hoped This person just graduated college. This is a wildly unremarkable piece of writing about a widely discussed issue, and the author has no unique insight into the problem. The sanctimony of repeating "This is Silicon Valley" over and over as if this pedestrian blogpost carries the weight of an MLK speech is just silly. Yes, life can be disappointing…

While it may not live up to your editorial standards, it's clearly resonating with this audience. Maybe attack the ideas and not the structure / style of the piece? It has nothing to do with the author "finding meaning." It's critiquing an overpriced, socially bankrupt culture and area, and the toll that can take on mental health and happiness.

I mean, I could do that, but that's kind of missing the point. In fact, I don't particularly disagree with the ideas. I think it would be pretty hard to find people who do! That's what makes the piece so banal - it's saying things that everyone will agree with in a very fluffy, very unexamined way.

>It's critiquing an overpriced, socially bankrupt culture and area, and the toll that can take on mental health and happiness.

This is what the piece _thinks_ it's critiquing. That's what it wants us to think too. But I'm arguing that it's very obvious where the author is coming from. You can tell from the examples she picks that she's just basically a new Google hire who's not really fitting in, and feeling disillusioned with her cohort. "Everybody goes to Lake Tahoe for the weekend"? Tell me that's not coming directly from somebody who's feeling bored and unfulfilled and surrounded by people she hasn't bonded with. And so my point is that this is something that a lot of people go through, and it doesn't have much to do with the monotony of Silicon Valley or the moral decay of our society (which, as a reminder, I don't really deny as real phenomena!). This is basically a diary entry of someone walking through a tough time in their life, but it's trying to bring the weight of society's problems along with it to make you feel like it's a deep insight. But it ain't. And we, as adults, should be able to understand what's going on there, and call it like it is.

Re: This Is Silicon Valley

#173

I'm gonna offer a slightly different perspective: SV isn't that nice, and it's not worth the price premium. There is a distinct lack of culture, of nightlife, of arts and humanities - even in San Francisco. We're a mediocre land of strip malls and suburbs masquerading as an international destination. Go to any other city and tell me that it's not MORE vibrant (Chicago, LA, NYC, Miami, Austin, Portland, Seattle, Houst…

I agree about the lack of culture, but I'm not sure it's much better anywhere else in the US. I used to love NYC for its out-there, underground cultural options, but now it just feels like a mall geared for tourists.

Chicago has much better culture; it feels like a diverse city that is actually alive, not just a cookie cutter promenade trying to sell you things. That being said, the politics are pretty messed up and the weather is atrociously bad.

Re: This Is Silicon Valley

#174

People need to seriously get over themselves. The world is not fair. Life is not fair. Neither of them ever have been and neither of them ever will be. Every city has major problems. Every person experiences tragedy. Up and moving to a new city is just a band-aid. You'll see that new city through rose colored glasses at first. But after a few years those rose colored glasses will become a lot clearer and you'll see a…

This blog post is certainly a glass-half-full perspective.

Re: This Is Silicon Valley

#175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tiger mom parenting has become a part of SV culture, or at least many schools in SV.

True but it’s much more prevalent in first generation immigrant families especially from Asia, so there’s some selection bias. Yes, some areas can be 30-90% this demographic makeup (eg cupertino schools) but it is not the norm for the entire Bay Area.

Right, but since the article is talking about the SV elite (both in terms of educational and economic attainment, and one follows the other), it seems pertinent.

Re: This Is Silicon Valley

#176

I totally bought into the Silicon Valley dream. I moved to the bay area to work at Netflix and launch a startup. I bootstrapped my first company because I didn't know how to raise VC money. That was pretty great. For my second company I raised millions of dollars from VCs. I went to exclusive parties, did press interviews and had a huge net-worth (on paper). I became the person I always envied. It was HUGELY disappoi…

The disappointment you describe is either because your achievements don't actually contribute to your core values or the benefits are short lived.

I recommend taking some time to figure out what your core values are.

Why did you want to start a successful startup? What were you really chasing after? Some superficial answers might be financial security or social status, but you should keep asking why these things are important until you arrive at something that is important just because you feel it is. These are your core values.

Once you figure out your core values, you'll find that:

1) The event that resulted in disappointment either didn't contribute to one of your core values

2) The core value that you've identified is partially out of your control, and so, your achievement made you feel good, but it was only temporary.

To me, values are the measuring sticks by which people quantify success in life. Whether or not we realize it, we constantly measure our actions against our values, and how we 'measure up' determines our self-worth.

Once we actually know what we value, we can either change those values (bc they are too extrinsic), or design our life to optimally fulfill them.

Re: This Is Silicon Valley

#177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's a little invasive to go out of your way to find someone's social media profiles to help prove a point in a thread on a hacker news post

I didn't go out of my way, I clicked his profile here, which has a link to his website, which has all of his social media on it. I made an honest attempt to understand someone before engaging with them, next time I'll just spew some uninformed BS if that's better?

I didn't see your post before it was deleted, but i'm genuinely curious. I live in SF, and I'm doing well, but I was not born into this world. A good chunk of my friend group has died of heroin overdoses, and the rest fled to Texas to work on oil fields because there was no other escape from painkiller addiction.

I _hate_ having to bring up my sadness credentials in this area. Everyone is always trying to prove how hard they work and how broken they are. Try going to Modesto. Try talking to an Uber driver. We're not "all broken", its just most of us have never had to struggle, ever. The appeal to culture destitution is just silly - no, not everyone here talks only about startups and blockchain. Yes, we all want to go back to our home towns with some savings. No, there is no humanitarian crisis in the bay area tech scene.

I assume you came after me for being white male from California? Remember, my point is that our lives _are NOT_ so difficult... I should not have to justify my perspective with my own personal tragic history, and that's _exactly_ what my problem with this article is.

Re: This Is Silicon Valley

#178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't go out of my way, I clicked his profile here, which has a link to his website, which has all of his social media on it. I made an honest attempt to understand someone before engaging with them, next time I'll just spew some uninformed BS if that's better?

I didn't see your post before it was deleted, but i'm genuinely curious. I live in SF, and I'm doing well, but I was not born into this world. A good chunk of my friend group has died of heroin overdoses, and the rest fled to Texas to work on oil fields because there was no other escape from painkiller addiction. I _hate_ having to bring up my sadness credentials in this area. Everyone is always trying to prove how h…

> I didn't see your post before it was deleted

It wasn't deleted. There's a setting in your profile called "showdead" which will allow you to see all the flag-killed comments.

Re: This Is Silicon Valley

#179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live and co-founded my current company in a colder northern Canadian city. Often we get derided by larger urban centres in Canada, similar to being labeled "flyover" country. But what I've found is that there is a sweet spot in terms of city size (mine is about 1 million) where the community feels small enough that people seem to legitimately care about each other, and champion each other's successes, but the benef…

What city is this?

Most likely Edmonton, unless parent was loose with his 1M pop estimate.

Re: This Is Silicon Valley

#180

Hi Gloria, yes this is the real world, where -- if we fixate on negativity -- everything is worse than we'd like it to be. Running away from the problems you see is a sure way NOT to fix them, and if everyone thought the way you did (or never grew out of that mindset) then problems would not be solved. Unfortunately, you seemed to focus on how bad YOUR city was and criticize the people YOU associate with and ultimate…

Your comment is basically just pure FUD and name calling. The author's entire point is that the culture of SV is one that she does not find to be good for her. You're not even asking what did she do to work to change it, your cherry picking random strawman and attacking it. A city planning meeting isn't going to change the culture of an entire area. Her giving resources to a homeless person doesn't change the fact th…

Interesting, you say my argument has no substance, then you immediately go on and address all the substance within it. "She does not find to be good to her". What was the process by which she found it not to be good? "You're not asking what did she do". Seriously? I read her entire post; if she had discussed her attempts to change the culture which was more than "hold discussions about social issues" with her peers at Google who she describes as "fake, self-serving, status-seeking" then I would have a different opinion.

Every productive suggestion I make to change the culture -- which me and some of my friends do (rarely, we're not perfect or close to it) -- you argue against with a resigned fatalism.

"Would you stay in a city that made you feel that way." And here's where we differ. There's a process, a reason why something makes you feel a certain way. And if you short-circuit personal responsibility, if you never act out or different in the world (or in your relationship) to see whether your nihilistic despair matches reality, that is juvenile. Maybe you don't have the bandwidth to tackle the problem. Fine. But you still take an L for never confronting the world, for never breaking through your inward solipsistic perceptions.

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