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We Need Chrome No More

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Re: We Need Chrome No More

#491

Post by droidist2 »

peruvian wrote: post #422
craftinator wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I surmise it is because HN attracts a higher percentage of critical thinkers than many other boards. A startling amount of JS on the web falls into the following categories: 1) Advertisement 2) Tracking 3) Useless animation I don't care for any of those things. I generally prefer simple html pages that load <1 second, take very few resources, do not track any information about me, and don't use any mouse-reactive ani…

It's more likely that most of the "critical thinkers" you speak of write JavaScript for money everyday. Even on HN the amount of JS blockers is tiny but it seems higher because they always have to mention they block JS.

So is "I block JS" the new "I don't own a TV"?

Re: We Need Chrome No More

#492

Post by speedplane »

eitland wrote: post #490
Aeolun wrote: post #445

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very well is relative. Chrome is better, even now, from a feature and performance perspective, but the tradeoff has become acceptable for a sense of privacy. That’s my opinion anyway.

Won't argue about the performance, you might very well be right and I cannot prove anything. Feel free to expand on what features you still miss in Firefox that exists in Chrome though. Looking from the other side Chromes extension API looks like a toy compared to Firefox, even after Mozilla "nerfed" it. (And ours is improving while Chrome is actively trying to remove even some of the most used features from theirs.)

My issue with Firefox is that it's just slower. I've read the articles showing that the rendering engine is just as fast or faster, and I don't doubt it, but it definitely feels a lot slower in real-life tasks with dozens of tabs and windows, constantly switching, opening, closing. I know Chrome "fakes" it's speediness using tricks, but I wish Firefox did the same.

Re: We Need Chrome No More

#493

Post by Lorkki »

perlgeek wrote: post #25
mapgrep wrote: post #7

I enjoyed this post, but I take issue with the idea that Chrome was initially adopted, or served, "to break the Web free from corporate greed." Chrome's appeal was primarily technical. Each tab got its own process and could crash without taking down the entire browser. No one else had this at the time, and it was a big deal because Flash was still widespread so sites were even less stable than they are today. Luckily…

> Chrome's appeal was primarily technical. Each tab got its own process and could crash without taking down the entire browser. Curious, I remember speed being the primary reason. Google invented V8 (the javascript engine), with some pretty decent optimizations and a well-working JIT on i386/amd64 platforms. At the time when chromium came out, it handled some JS-heavy applications very nicely that Firefox struggled w…

>> Chrome's appeal was primarily technical. Each tab got its own process and could crash without taking down the entire browser.

>Curious, I remember speed being the primary reason

It was probably both. I know I was definitely sick of sites (mostly Flash) crashing the browser and throwing my entire session in the bin. I was probably already using some Gecko-based "light" browser instead of Firefox, but V8 did make a difference when using the emerging web app style sites like Gmail.

Re: We Need Chrome No More

#494

Post by Sammi »

dak1 wrote: post #34

Other browsers need to catch up to Chrome with their development tools. I'd be happy to use Safari or Firefox for development, but... - I can't disable CORS in Firefox (yes, sometimes you have to disable CORS rather than modify the Allow-Origin header response, for example if you need to test against a production backend) (and, no, CORS Everywhere is not a sufficient solution). - I can't inspect WebSocket frames in a…

I cannot use the Firefox dev tools because they completely choke on the Angular app I'm working on, while Chrome chugs along like nobodies business.

I am using Firefox as my daily driver, because the browser itself is fast. But the dev tools just don't deliver. Waiting for a breakpoint to hit and open takes forever.

Re: We Need Chrome No More

#495

Post by jhasse »

stephenr wrote: post #479
jhasse wrote: post #474

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But by that measure safari is open source because WebKit is open source. There's a lot more closed source code in Safari than there's in Chrome. But sure: Why not give them credit for open-sourcing WebKit? Safari is closer to open-source than IE.

And yet I trust Safari a fucking lot more than I trust Chrome. Something about not being a business reliant on harvesting every bit of personal information possible.

And you're probably right. "Open-source-ness" shouldn't be the only measure when valuing software.

Re: We Need Chrome No More

#496

Post by slurpeedog »

pojzon wrote: post #337
JohnTHaller wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chrome's growth was due to speed initially, but at least a decent chunk of it later was due to trickery. I've had to uninstall Chrome from my Mom's computer multiple times. It's one of the most popular bundleware apps out there. Free antivirus, games, system 'utilities', Adobe Flash updates, etc all got paid to employ dark patterns to sneak Chrome onto PCs and have it automatically set as the default and pinned to yo…

This reason alone is tragic enough to NEVER use Chrome. And of course it has a complete garbage resources management which can be easly tested by opening few hundred empty tabs.. (mostly freezes whole OS around 180-270 tabs on modern desktops)

which browser right now can handle 180-270 tabs lol?

Re: We Need Chrome No More

#497

Post by detaro »

slurpeedog wrote: post #496
pojzon wrote: post #337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This reason alone is tragic enough to NEVER use Chrome. And of course it has a complete garbage resources management which can be easly tested by opening few hundred empty tabs.. (mostly freezes whole OS around 180-270 tabs on modern desktops)

which browser right now can handle 180-270 tabs lol?

Firefox does so easily, although Chrome did too last I used it.

Re: We Need Chrome No More

#498

Post by untangle »

I did not find the author's points very compelling wrt the "we need chrome no more" link-baity title. Clearly, many users -- mostly devs -- do need Chrome.

But more importantly I think that articles such as this deflect from the real abuse-of-power that Google wields and that's in advertising. Google can and has shut down whole businesses by withholding access to its ad platforms. I'm not sure that Google has ever hurt anybody by denying access to Chrome.

Re: We Need Chrome No More

#499

Post by zaarn »

kkarakk wrote: post #489
zaarn wrote: post #481

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see how those really benefit the end user. Firefox has developed Container Tabs, First Party Isolation, integrated Tracking Blocker, an early alpha for a password manager, Screenshots, Firefox Sync, DNS over HTTP and eSNI, not to mention that Mozilla lets addons do much more with the browser so an addon can really change how your browser works instead of being severely limited in what it can do.

i'm a developer and i find it hard to give a shit about any of that, container tabs are cute but they end up breaking a lot of websites, the rest is not even a blip on my radar as for addons changing how my browser works - no thanks, i'd rather have a consistently nice browser experience than have to re-install addons everywhere

If container tabs break your website, I suspect you're doing something shady with tracking. It does literally nothing but isolate cookies/storage/scripts.

Re: We Need Chrome No More

#500

Post by newsgremlin »

I almost regret invariably suggesting chrome in every conversation back when IE was leading, such is hindsight.

Perhaps instead of telling people what to use we should be telling them how to use, or more accurately how to change. Once people are invested in a platform or service it's hard to get them to change their mindset, especially over issues taken for granted like privacy.

There's a lot more attention to social media on the same issue of privacy, this would be the ideal time to bring chrome into this discussion to work on the 'detachment', self-imposed roadblocks, logging out, deleting apps, disabling notifications.

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