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K3s – Lightweight Kubernetes

k3s.io

51–60 of 194 posts

Re: K3s – Lightweight Kubernetes

#51
post #2

Do you think kubernetes are necessary for small businesses?

Kubernetes isn't even necessary for medium and large businesses. It's more a question of what problem you're trying to solve.

Kubernetes is only relevant if you have the need to scale your service quickly and/or often. If you run it on your own hardware the value is even more tricky to work out, it can still be a benefit. Whether or not it help you save on hardware cost is extremely dependent on your usage.

Re: K3s – Lightweight Kubernetes

#52
post #41
post #22

Welcome to 2019 where an "embedded" system has 1GB RAM. The problem of GO is that all those unused libraries are loaded in RAM instead of staying on disk, and loaded when needed. An helloworld in GO (around 1.6MB) is still too large for my openwrt router.

> Welcome to 2019 where an "embedded" system has 1GB RAM. Thirty years ago someone could have said the same when seeing laptop computers and remembering when computer literally used to occupy whole large rooms. Come on, let's stop doing this kind of jokes, they add nothing to the discussion.

The problem is that the bottom end of 1k RAM still exists. In fact, because the main change is that it gets cheaper every year, it's even more prevalent. Just because there aren't lots of blog posts, doesn't mean that isn't a large proportion of the industry.

The word 'embedded' is not well defined, but if you use it on things with 1GB of RAM, what do you call a PIC with 1K?

My personal definition of embedded (which is of course still flawed) is anything without an MMU. A Raspberry Pi isn't embedded for instance, it's just a small computer, just like a phone.

Re: K3s – Lightweight Kubernetes

#53
post #41
post #22

Welcome to 2019 where an "embedded" system has 1GB RAM. The problem of GO is that all those unused libraries are loaded in RAM instead of staying on disk, and loaded when needed. An helloworld in GO (around 1.6MB) is still too large for my openwrt router.

> Welcome to 2019 where an "embedded" system has 1GB RAM. Thirty years ago someone could have said the same when seeing laptop computers and remembering when computer literally used to occupy whole large rooms. Come on, let's stop doing this kind of jokes, they add nothing to the discussion.

At some point in time, the physical realities of electrons and metal wires will kick in. Then the growth will stop and you'll start kicking your own ass about performance and pointer arithmetic and cache policy.

Maybe that point in time is now, maybe it isn't. But it is coming nonetheless, that is one thing we can be sure of.

Re: K3s – Lightweight Kubernetes

#54
post #47

Oh nice - this is by the Rancher guys. Would love to compare this not with k8s, but with Docker Swarm. Docker Swarm on Raspberry Pi is a very common thing. So, from a performance perspective, these are on par. Another question is around ingress and network plugin - is it a seamless "batteries included" experience ? Because these are two of the biggest pains in k8s to decide and setup .

Based on the README [0], quickly comparing to Swarm: - this has the same great K8S API, that Swarm lacks. (Deployment is a first class citizen in kube land, but you only have to make do with the service YMLs in the Swarm sphere.) - k3s lacks some in-tree plugins, that swarm might have (mount cloud provider managed block device), but there are out of tree addons - sqlite instead of etcd3 [but available], so out of the…

>this has the same great K8S API, that Swarm lacks. (Deployment is a first class citizen in kube land, but you only have to make do with the service YMLs in the Swarm sphere.)

With all due respect, some (like me) consider that a feature of Swarm.

If k3s comes with the same API (and implicit yaml complexity) of k8s, but just reduces RAM usage...well that's not very interesting for me.

Docker Swarm is very lean - there are zillions of videos of how people are building interesting raspberry Pi stacks using it (https://youtu.be/mMpZpa7uUSk).

But for most people using Swarm - they are using it for one reason only : simplicity.

Re: K3s – Lightweight Kubernetes

#56

Anyone know if this will run on a Pixelbook? (inside the Crostini linux virtual machine in ChromeOS). Thanks

Got excited about this too, but unfortunately no, it doesn't run on Crostini. Fails with querying netfilter.

Also tried through docker-compose from the GH repository. It starts the k3s server fine but fails on starting the nodes as they require privileged container mode, which doesn't work on Crostini at the moment.

Re: K3s – Lightweight Kubernetes

#57
post #48
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMO any program with a sufficiently high number of entities in a low level language contains an ad hoc informally-specified bug-ridden slow implementation of a garbage collector

Not exactly, a garbage collector is by definition a collector (there is sweeps rather than per-reference and more importantly has runtime cost) . I think, manual memory management is a lot more similar to a poorman's ARC implementation.

A poorman's ARC implementation might not collect cycles, but it does not do double free() or use-after-free().

Re: K3s – Lightweight Kubernetes

#58

Technically speaking: cool Practically speaking: I worry this will become a parallel but subtlety different implementation of Kubernetes with it's own quirks.

That's why CNCF is thrilled that Rancher passed our Certified Kubernetes conformance tests for k3s prior to the public announcement.

https://landscape.cncf.io/category=certified-kubernetes-dist...

Re: K3s – Lightweight Kubernetes

#59
post #37
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same. What does it have to do with kubernetes?

Well if you want a nice cheap, small cluster, with HA, and wide community support, and a container model so you have to trust the applications less. What else are you going to use? What else is going to provide a nice easy to use HA raspberry pi that's $100 ish?

Can containers really improve security in case of IoT where there's a single application that pretty much needs access to the whole device? I think they may only increase the attack surface. High availability seems like an orthogonal problem in case of IoT. It's not like you can spawn more devices. But I acknowledge that it may be just me getting old.

Still happy to learn more arguments for using k8s in IoT (if you are already using k8s then yes, seems like k3s would make sense).

Re: K3s – Lightweight Kubernetes

#60
post #22

Welcome to 2019 where an "embedded" system has 1GB RAM. The problem of GO is that all those unused libraries are loaded in RAM instead of staying on disk, and loaded when needed. An helloworld in GO (around 1.6MB) is still too large for my openwrt router.

Go has support for plugins (OS X and Linux only currently).

However unlike Modula-3, Mesa/Ceda or Oberon(-2)/Active/Component Pascal they are load only instead of being possible to unload them, and they require manual binding of symbols.

For this kind of system work a more feature rich dynamism is certaly a big missing feature.

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