Live data from Hacker News

Berlin Builds Ideas to Stage a Housing Revolution

citylab.com

191–194 of 194 posts

Re: Berlin Builds Ideas to Stage a Housing Revolution

#191
post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

McSweeney's already covered this subject well: "I Will Do Anything to End Homelessness Except Build More Homes" https://www.mcsweeneys.net/articles/i-will-do-anything-to-en... . Berlin will do anything to reduce housing costs except build more housing.

At least in big cities it is almost never that people don't want to build more, but that: 1. Property owner do not want to see their quite significant loans, or investments, decrease in value. 2. Renters do not want to get priced out of the city, having to leave a good job and move their kids away from their friends. In addition to that while seemingly intuitive in practice building doesn't seem to decrease costs. Pr…

3. Land owners and construction companies want to make as much money as possible.

Everyone does. Greed is only greed when it's someone else. Developers in cities with permissive land-use and zoning laws aren't better people than developers in cities like San Francisco or Vancouver. It's just that there are enough of them and there's enough development that they need to compete with each other.

Unless you can override these three groups, or get them to agree, it is a social issue and building more will make things worse. Look at the record from essentially every city that has been building

Stop. Just stop. Seriously. This trope needs to die now.

This is exactly what anti-housing advocates in Vancouver are claiming right now - that the city has been building and building and building, and prices just keep going up. So why give those awful developers what they want, right?

What they don't mention is that the metro area population is growing by more than 2% per year and compared to the number of homes being built each year, we're hopelessly behind. The reason prices keep going up is because we're not building enough, such is the incredible demand to live and work here. And I suspect this is the case with most cities with crazy-low rental vacancy rates and crazy high prices.

Berlin (and Vancouver, and San Francisco) will do anything to reduce housing costs except build more housing.

Re: Berlin Builds Ideas to Stage a Housing Revolution

#192
post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At some point you’ll run into construction cost limits for multistory dwellings. I don’t know how close Berlin is to that point but given how much cheaper their rent is than other major cities they’re probably doing a better job than most of building housing.

Berlin is not close to this tradeoff point. Tokyo's special wards have a population over twice as large as Berlin in an area about 2/3rds as large as Berlin.

Construction costs are not the same everywhere. AFAIK the ground Berlin is built on is not suitable for tall (=heavy) buildings.

Re: Berlin Builds Ideas to Stage a Housing Revolution

#193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "I mean, I'd love a beachfront property in Maui but we can't all have that" The person you're replying to is basically saying: "having a place you can stay in, to keep you alive and going rather than homeless and broken, a safety net in essence - should be a right". Your response: "but we can't hand over free beachfront properties in Maui for everyone". You're diverting the discussion ("but look at what communism d…

This isn't just about having shelter, this is about having it in Berlin specifically. Who is entitled to that? The answer can't be "everyone".

> Who is entitled to that?

People whose home is Berlin, for starters.

Re: Berlin Builds Ideas to Stage a Housing Revolution

#194

All you people claiming that the only way to reduce housing costs is to build more housing are missing the other only way to reduce housing costs. Remember, there is not only supply but also demand. We need to reduce population growth to below zero. A sustainable world population is probably close to 0.9B, far less than the current level of about 9B, and significantly less than projected “stable” population of around…

That doesn't work because it's not only general population growth that's driving housing shortages in cities, it's that people are moving to popular cities from less popular places. San Francisco doesn't have a housing problem because too many people had babies in the last 10 years, it has a housing problem because way more people want to move to San Francisco from other US cities than it can support. Another way to…

Is Japan’s population currently 1/10th of its peak?
Post reply on HN