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Running a Bakery on Emacs and PostgreSQL

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Re: Running a Bakery on Emacs and PostgreSQL

#61

Post by retzkek »

whynotminot wrote: post #9
kiallmacinnes wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a downside to this though .. For this bakery, if you hire someone, theres a reasonable chance they can use a spreadsheet (maybe not add new recipes etc, but use..). I'd bet is very unlikely the same will be true of SQL and emacs. In tech/development, it's akin to someone building a system in some obscure language, because they are most productive and the only ones developing it today.. It's likely that syste…

This is a very important point. Choose tools that are: (1) right for the project (2) right for the current team (3) right for the future team (3) might be hard given you don't know who joins later, and the engineers might also not have a say if they're not involved in hiring. But you can generally make decent guesses. The odds of the next baker you higher knowing SQL and emacs? Pretty low... the odds they know Excel?…

> The odds of the next baker you higher knowing SQL and emacs?

Maybe he'll be looking to hire another person like himself, moving from tech - I'm sure many (most?) of us have toyed with the idea of becoming a baker, cook, farmer, cabinetmaker, wainwright, shipwright, etc. Blog posts like this certainly don't help!

Re: Running a Bakery on Emacs and PostgreSQL

#62

Post by kiallmacinnes »

frogcoder wrote: post #21
kiallmacinnes wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a downside to this though .. For this bakery, if you hire someone, theres a reasonable chance they can use a spreadsheet (maybe not add new recipes etc, but use..). I'd bet is very unlikely the same will be true of SQL and emacs. In tech/development, it's akin to someone building a system in some obscure language, because they are most productive and the only ones developing it today.. It's likely that syste…

Well, he built the system, Emacs is the front end. It's just an awkward front end for most of the people, but with proper training, anyone can pick it up, it's not like ask them to maintain the system. For new formulas, yeah, It's hard to input new formulas, even in spreadsheet. The system is somehow complex, you probably need a UI for new formulas too, even if it's in spreadsheet.

Honestly, I'm not so sure. Emacs isn't known to be user friendly, I can easily imagine many non-techies simply refusing (consciously or, more likely, unconsciously..) to learn it.

Re: Running a Bakery on Emacs and PostgreSQL

#63

Post by weavie »

ubermonkey wrote: post #47

I haven't read the article (yes, I know, sorry), but the headline reminded me of a donut shop here in Houston. I don't know if the sign is intentionally this way, or if the middle letter of the first word in the name fell off, leaving behind the short, horizontal mount point, but either way it amuses emacs folks a lot, because it appears to say: M-x Donuts Who among us hasn't wanted, at least once, to invoke that mod…

This one?

https://i.imgur.com/E4EkEMf.png

Re: Running a Bakery on Emacs and PostgreSQL

#64

Post by ohnoabigshark »

Former CS major, current chef/owner checking in. Restaurants feel pretty ripe for voice assistants/AR but unfortunately lack the necessary technological and financial capital to make it happen, imo. Being able to record and retrieve important information without stopping your work (pulling up and scaling a recipe while chopping onions, for example) saves an immense amount of time in the kitchen. This is especially true during a busy service when circumstances and priorities can change quickly and without warning. The need is there, my question lies in whether an industry with tight profit margins can afford to pay for such a product.

Re: Running a Bakery on Emacs and PostgreSQL

#65

Post by lm28469 »

rekshaw wrote: post #41

As people flock to become programmers, as a population we will become increasingly technologically literate. Sooner or later we will enter an age where programming is as second nature as writing. Communication at the end of the day is a way to get people to understand what we want. Programming is very similar only directed at machines, and as machines continue to replace people in trivial (and not so trivial) tasks,…

I'd say it's the opposite, just like everyone has a car but barely anyone could do the most basic maintenance on it. This is arguably getting worse in every sector because of increasing complexity. (trade off for increasing convenience, as usual)

Familiarity is not knowledge.

I'd even say that technology sets us back because know we're all thinking we're much smarter than we are, I can google any issue I have and find an answer with minor brain usage. I don't need to know how basic orientation skills because I have google maps, etc ...

It's a nice tool for sure, but the only "second nature" we're getting is the "second nature" of googling anything that take us more than 5 seconds of brain time.

I lived without a phone for a few weeks (unwillingly) and I was surprised about how little of my daily life I could still do without frictions.

The only lingua franca I see coming is emojis and memes, not programming languages. That's a nice example of tech worker echo chamber / over optimism / bubble though.

Re: Running a Bakery on Emacs and PostgreSQL

#66

Post by rekshaw »

thrownaway954 wrote: post #54
rekshaw wrote: post #41

As people flock to become programmers, as a population we will become increasingly technologically literate. Sooner or later we will enter an age where programming is as second nature as writing. Communication at the end of the day is a way to get people to understand what we want. Programming is very similar only directed at machines, and as machines continue to replace people in trivial (and not so trivial) tasks,…

You do realize that the author was a programmer before becoming a baker.

Yes, hence my point! I believe we will see more and more of this. Today programming is seen as a skilled art that only the few can comprehend, much like writing was back in ancient times. And so, only a programmer can effectively apply custom technology to non-technical tasks like baking.

In the future, programming will be more accessible, and potentially be so common and part of the upbringing of children that anyone will be able to program simple things they need.

I also see the counter-argument that this is utopian and people will just get more and more stupid. But one can only hope it is not the case! :)

Re: Running a Bakery on Emacs and PostgreSQL

#67

Post by nickjj »

rekshaw wrote: post #41

As people flock to become programmers, as a population we will become increasingly technologically literate. Sooner or later we will enter an age where programming is as second nature as writing. Communication at the end of the day is a way to get people to understand what we want. Programming is very similar only directed at machines, and as machines continue to replace people in trivial (and not so trivial) tasks,…

Lots of people are already really good programmers, they just don't know it.

I know a few people who are really good plumbers, electricians and general contractors. Basically, they can see a problem and have the skills to break it down and then create a solution.

None of them can type very well and barely know how to use the internet but I bet if they focused on learning the basics of computers they would end up being top notch programmers.

Re: Running a Bakery on Emacs and PostgreSQL

#69

Post by perlgeek »

ohnoabigshark wrote: post #64

Former CS major, current chef/owner checking in. Restaurants feel pretty ripe for voice assistants/AR but unfortunately lack the necessary technological and financial capital to make it happen, imo. Being able to record and retrieve important information without stopping your work (pulling up and scaling a recipe while chopping onions, for example) saves an immense amount of time in the kitchen. This is especially tr…

I guess one of the main challenges is making things reliable. Voice assistants in their current form in loud, stressful environments sound like a source of endless frustration.

> The need is there, my question lies in whether an industry with tight profit margins can afford to pay for such a product.

If it actually saves time and helps fulfill orders quicker, why not?

Re: Running a Bakery on Emacs and PostgreSQL

#70

Post by rekshaw »

lm28469 wrote: post #65
rekshaw wrote: post #41

As people flock to become programmers, as a population we will become increasingly technologically literate. Sooner or later we will enter an age where programming is as second nature as writing. Communication at the end of the day is a way to get people to understand what we want. Programming is very similar only directed at machines, and as machines continue to replace people in trivial (and not so trivial) tasks,…

I'd say it's the opposite, just like everyone has a car but barely anyone could do the most basic maintenance on it. This is arguably getting worse in every sector because of increasing complexity. (trade off for increasing convenience, as usual) Familiarity is not knowledge. I'd even say that technology sets us back because know we're all thinking we're much smarter than we are, I can google any issue I have and fin…

Valid counterpoint. However, we could still be witnessing metaphorical "acne" resulting from instant communication. With no more time-delays or costs associated with communication, the threshold for what makes something worth communicating drops.

What I'm speaking of is not 20 years from now, but 500. When we've moved past the banal, when people have assimilated instant communication but have also learned the preciousness of time and the negative long term effects of information overload. In a way, a bit like how we quickly moved past custom ringtones, but on a much grander scale. Programming is relatively novel nowawadays. It won't be in 500 years, it will just be like a hammer.

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