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Is it still ok to have kids in face of climate change?

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Re: Is it still ok to have kids in face of climate change?

#101

Post by userulluipeste »

ergothus wrote: post #83
Accipitriform wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ...yet what is the best thing for the kids? That's a harder thing to know - you can't really compare "not existing" with "living in a world that has a ton of issues". LOL! I certainly can 'compare "not existing" with "living in a world that has a ton of issues"'. In the "don't exist" case, there is no possibility of anything good happening. In the "exist" case, there is a possibility of something good happening. Ea…

See, this FEELS like a simple choice - but think of the implications of what you're saying. If existing is flat out always better than not - and I want to note this is NOT about suicide (ending existence) but about creating the existence in the first place) - then you're saying the moral thing is to have as many children as possible. For everyone. Taken to a hyperbolic extreme, this is clearly ridiculous. But this is…

I'm not sure you realize that the values that gets in one's mind and govern one's decision towards procreation is one form of current natural selection. It's funny to see some of the world's best and most promising getting bogged down by or getting utterly lost in some "smart people problem" instead of using their capacity to come ahead in the game of life.

Re: Is it still ok to have kids in face of climate change?

#102

Post by LifeLiverTransp »

soVeryTired wrote: post #94
crobertsbmw wrote: post #24

I’ve always believed that if you’re a smart, educated, motivated person (if your reading this than I’m assuming you are one) that probably the best thing you can do for the world is to have kids. Those kids will likely contribute to the world in all sorts of ways that we can’t imagine.

You could always adopt kids and give them the benefit of your intelligence, education, and motivation.

The "adopt" kids usually are the kids of alcoholic parents, who gave them a subtle but unrepairable "drink" too much. You will not be informed about that by government- and you will go through hell trying to repair what alcohol made unrepairable.

Would advise that only if government guarantees no https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fetal_alcohol_spectrum_disorde...

Re: Is it still ok to have kids in face of climate change?

#103

Post by rinchik »

crobertsbmw wrote: post #24

I’ve always believed that if you’re a smart, educated, motivated person (if your reading this than I’m assuming you are one) that probably the best thing you can do for the world is to have kids. Those kids will likely contribute to the world in all sorts of ways that we can’t imagine.

it's you're, mr. smart and educated.

Children is the worst thing you can do for the climate and for the planet in general. Utopian hope that future generations will magically save the world is naive and plainly misleading. Reproduction is , considering that we are actively altering/murdering natural selection process among humans, there’s no way "more humans" is a solution.

Some optimists have theorized that population growth will stabilize at 9B, but in no way that can be true. Gene is selfish, after all.

Re: Is it still ok to have kids in face of climate change?

#104

Post by candiodari »

Angostura wrote: post #54
lqet wrote: post #30

My ancestors thought it was okay to have kids during times in which many scholars where certain the apocalypse was due in the next 25 years, during periods in which the plague killed more than half of the population, during the 30 years war and in a time when there was a realistic chance of nuclear annihilation in the next 10 years. I am glad they did.

Did any of those groups they have a scientific basis for believing that having kids would speed up the advent of the apocalypse or worsen its effects? Let's not draw false parallels.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malthusianism

So: yes. Many times. In fact it would be accurate to say that a portion of the population has believed this, now for hundreds of years.

Re: Is it still ok to have kids in face of climate change?

#105

Post by misingnoglic »

LifeLiverTransp wrote: post #102
soVeryTired wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could always adopt kids and give them the benefit of your intelligence, education, and motivation.

The "adopt" kids usually are the kids of alcoholic parents, who gave them a subtle but unrepairable "drink" too much. You will not be informed about that by government- and you will go through hell trying to repair what alcohol made unrepairable. Would advise that only if government guarantees no https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fetal_alcohol_spectrum_disorde...

Do you have any statistics on that, or is that just your personal bias?

Re: Is it still ok to have kids in face of climate change?

#106

Post by rand0mbits »

NLips wrote: post #29
natalyarostova wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not so sure that it does. I would say the expected cost of climate change to the lives of children born today is still far far less then the expected cost in the past due to disease, war, famine (etc). So the poster above is noting that if people were, or we would have, been okay with having kids in the past, then we still should today.

The question is phrased ambiguously, but the article makes it clearer that what is meant is: "Is it still OK _for the planet_ to have kids...", not "Is it still OK _for the kids_ to have kids..." EDIT: actually, I'm not sure which one of those the representative was getting at.

"Is it still OK _for the planet_ to have kids..."

That's a strange question. The planet doesn't have feelings, so it doesn't really care whether or not we have kids.

Other living organisms on the planet may care. But the rock we're on surely doesn't.

Re: Is it still ok to have kids in face of climate change?

#107

Post by LifeLiverTransp »

elamje wrote: post #16
patatino wrote: post #9

I have a 4 month old daughter and looking a the history I‘m pretty glad she is born today and not 50 or 100 years ago.

Yes, the question is in the context of climate change, not other variables.

At first I was afraid, i was petrified, kept thinking I could never live without stable climate by my side But then I spent so many nights thinking how my lifestyle did no wrong, and I grew strong, and I learned how to get along. And so they're back, from outer space -I just walked in to find them here with that nihilistic look upon their face. I should have avoided that foolish thread, I should have made those defeatists leave their key, if I'd known for just one second they'd be back from the eighties to bother me Go on now, go, walk out the door Just turn around now 'Cause you're not welcome anymore Weren't you the one who tried to hedonistically accept the long goodbye Do you think I'd crumble Did you think I'd lay down and die? Oh no, not I, I will survive Oh, as long as I know how to love, I know I'll stay alive I've got all my life to live And I've got all my love to give and I'll survive I will survive, hey, hey

Re: Is it still ok to have kids in face of climate change?

#108

Post by elektor »

strict9 wrote: post #63

It is an important speculative question, but also misses the fact right now that worldwide fertility is crashing[1]. [1] https://www.bbc.com/news/health-46118103

The global fertility rate is 2.4, well above the 2.1 needed to stabilize the population, which is already over the carrying capacity of the planet.

Re: Is it still ok to have kids in face of climate change?

#109

Post by your-nanny »

teekert wrote: post #38

Yes, let's die out! Let's not even let any kid get born that may invent the key to nuclear fusion. Sure, let's just choose some non-sentient animals and plants over ourselves killing any chance of betterment right here and now. Let's not even try to spread out over the stars, let's make sure that any life on our current planet dies as soon as this planet dies instead of taking it with us across the barren ocean that…

I seriously wrestled with whether having kids was moral. Indeed, it seems highly probable that they will just grow up to witness and suffer in the next great extinction event.

Re: Is it still ok to have kids in face of climate change?

#110

Post by deogeo »

carno wrote: post #91
mc32 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is why it’s weird so many kids from other countries want to come here for their higher studies, right?

Not sure I get your point. I don't think it's weird at all. Because: - That happens to every country - One in three top US professors educated overseas https://www.timeshighereducation.com/news/one-in-three-top-u... - Most of their classmates will be foreign students too https://www.insidehighered.com/quicktakes/2017/10/11/foreign...

> That happens to every country

Both your sources are for the US only. How did you get to 'every country'?

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