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Where Are the Android Killer Apps?

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Re: Where Are the Android Killer Apps?

#141

Post by Locke1689 »

dejb wrote: post #61
lukeschlather wrote: post #19

The entire article reads a bit like the scene in The Life of Brian where the Jewish rebels enumerate all the things the Romans have done for them, and then say "but aside from that, what have the Romans ever done for us?" I get where Gruber's coming from, and there seems to be a legitimate point in here about the difference between consoles and ordinary computers. But I'm not really seeing anything listed under the i…

> there seems to be a legitimate point in here about the difference between consoles and ordinary computers I still can't for the life of me understand why any self respecting geek would cheer on the 'console' model as the future of mobile computing. Sure, as a developer you have to make practical decisions about which platform to develop for. But as the platform you chose to use yourself? It's like saying that you'v…

It's specialized computation -- not that difficult to understand. The iPhone certainly isn't my development environment, either.

Re: Where Are the Android Killer Apps?

#142

Post by PostOnce »

I mentioned SL4A somewhere else, but I think it deserves its own comment.

http://code.google.com/p/android-scripting/

Python/Lua/Ruby/Perl/etc interpreters and scripts in your pocket. Imagine the potential.

[Obviously not a Killer App for the general public, but maybe for the HN crowd...]

Re: Where Are the Android Killer Apps?

#143

Post by gazrogers »

YooLi wrote: post #106
lusis wrote: post #97

I'd rather ask a different question. Who the hell cares? Seriously. Why is all this attention being paid to Android by various Apple-centric/Apple-leaning outlets? I'm not trying to be combative. If iOS is the superior platform then why keep drawing attention to something that, in your opinion, is inferior? Technically speaking Android and iOS are fairly even in features. Android has some things that iOS doesn't and…

Did you read the post? He doesn't phrase it at all as an iOS is better than Android argument. He's saying it's interesting that as large as Android is, why there isn't any good 3rd party apps exclusively for it. There are no "I must get an Android phone so I can run this" apps.

"I must get an Android phone so I can run this" apps, such as Swype (since the discussion only includes iOS and Android), are excluded from the argument by Gruber.

Re: Where Are the Android Killer Apps?

#144

Post by nochiel »

cheald wrote: post #20

Gruber seems to make the assertion that a platform only has worth based on its exclusive "killer apps". He goes wrong there and never really recovers. Android's strength is not its suite apps, it's its flexibility. It runs on an enormous range of hardware, and doesn't require that you buy into a single vendor's toolchain to use it. The core philosophical difference between the two platforms is "Steve Jobs decides wha…

"Gruber seems to make the assertion that a platform only has worth based on its exclusive 'killer apps'. He goes wrong there and never really recovers. Android's strength is not its suite apps, it's its flexibility."

It is baffling how you managed to read the article and still evade his point even though he addresses your rejoinder directly. Gruber says,

"At this point, I’m guessing, Android fans are ready to exclaim that the fact that Android supports things like home screen replacements (or other system-level tools, such as touchscreen keyboard replacements) — and that iOS does not — is precisely why they prefer Android, and/or consider iOS to be an unacceptable toy, or what have you. But, again, that’s not the argument I’m making. I’m talking about third-party developer exclusives — and the only ones Android has are ones that Apple doesn’t want."

Your opening salvo is baffling, because Gruber says, "I’m not saying Android is in trouble. The opposite, in fact: I think it’s going to continue growing — in terms of handset sales — despite this. And maybe as Android handset sales grow, this situation will change, and developers will start creating exclusive killer apps for the platform, drawn by the size of the market."

His main point is that Android is currently weak as a software platform. People don't choose Android because of its superior applications but because of its perceived flexibility/hackability. Developers don't see the Android app market as particularly profitable. The opposite holds true for iOS. He describes this as being a new phenomenon, the "app console market" which is a market that Android currently doesn't feature in.

We can extrapolate that if the situation with Android doesn't change, then Android could become the new Symbian, dominating a quasi-category of feature-smart-phones but with iOS and WP7 taking the more profitable segment of the market.

Re: Where Are the Android Killer Apps?

#145

Post by sandipc »

5teev wrote: post #95
callahad wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When speaking of passing data between applications, I'm specifically thinking of the use cases enabled by Android's intent system. Applications can register their ability to respond to and fulfill certain interactions, and then the OS mediates between them. Say, for instance, you're in the Twitter app and click on a link. Instead of embedding a UIWebView, the application fires off a message saying it needs something…

Not all applications embed a UIWebView, and many that do also offer opening in Safari as an option. There are also between-app communications like Twitter's "Save Draft to Birdhouse..." or sending addresses to the Maps application. Not as flexible as the workflows you describe in Android, to be sure, but in that data is being passed between its apps, I believe it was overly broad to describe iOS as focusing only on "…

I really think the Android back button makes all this possible (and perhaps better than on iOS devices. If a link in the iOS twitter app opens Maps, the only way to get back to where you were (pre-iOS4) was to hit home and launch the twitter app... which may have saved its state. In Android, such a workflow would just involve pressing the universal back button. I suppose in iOS4, you can now double tap home and find the twitter app in the list of open apps.

That's not to say Android is better for opening map links from twitter... just that it's a different way of doing things. I would say that most criticisms people have when jumping from android to iOS (or vice versa) stem from trying to use one OS in exactly the same way you used the other OS.

Re: Where Are the Android Killer Apps?

#146

Post by ergo98 »

I have no disagreement with Gruber here -- he is generally on the mark.

However I think it is a short-sighted perspective. The products that are in the market today often had many months to years of incubation end evolution time on them. A mere four months ago, iOS was still overwhelmingly where it was at, and on sites of the people making the apps -- like HN -- it had the dominant mindspace.

That has profoundly changed. On my Android I've noticed the pace of iterations of the top tier apps is reaching an incredible pace, as obviously what was an afterthought is starting to get equal billing to their iOS product.

Gruber is unquestionably right today. In three months, or six months, I think the equation will have dramatically changed.

Though it will never be about "killer apps" (where exclusivity is the definition). That antiquated notion has no place in modern computing. Note that Google makes all of their "killer apps" available on iOS as well, which is exactly how it should be. In an ideal every top tier app exists on multiple platforms.

Re: Where Are the Android Killer Apps?

#147

Post by erikpukinskis »

cheald wrote: post #20

Gruber seems to make the assertion that a platform only has worth based on its exclusive "killer apps". He goes wrong there and never really recovers. Android's strength is not its suite apps, it's its flexibility. It runs on an enormous range of hardware, and doesn't require that you buy into a single vendor's toolchain to use it. The core philosophical difference between the two platforms is "Steve Jobs decides wha…

How about things like Launcher Pro, Swype, SwiftKey, and AppBrain?

None of those apps actually do anything. None of those are apps that help me cook, or tell me where the bike shop is, or let me send a photo of my dog to my parents, or give me something fun to do for 15 minutes on the bus.

I think that's Gruber's point. Android is full of apps that either...

A) are for people who think fucking around with their computer/phone is a worthwhile activity

B) are essentially ports from iPhone

or C) suck

Re: Where Are the Android Killer Apps?

#148

Post by dejb »

Locke1689 wrote: post #141
dejb wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> there seems to be a legitimate point in here about the difference between consoles and ordinary computers I still can't for the life of me understand why any self respecting geek would cheer on the 'console' model as the future of mobile computing. Sure, as a developer you have to make practical decisions about which platform to develop for. But as the platform you chose to use yourself? It's like saying that you'v…

It's specialized computation -- not that difficult to understand. The iPhone certainly isn't my development environment, either.

> It's specialized computation

No it's not. The whole purpose of having an app store is to make it more general purpose. Why should anything be 'off limits' just because the device is small? Why is this not obvious to you?

> The iPhone certainly isn't my development environment, either.

.. and it never will be. But you added the word 'development', not me. I prefer to decide how I can use my computation devices and when they do not allow this then they should be regarded as toys.

Re: Where Are the Android Killer Apps?

#149

Post by carols10cents »

sandipc wrote: post #145
5teev wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not all applications embed a UIWebView, and many that do also offer opening in Safari as an option. There are also between-app communications like Twitter's "Save Draft to Birdhouse..." or sending addresses to the Maps application. Not as flexible as the workflows you describe in Android, to be sure, but in that data is being passed between its apps, I believe it was overly broad to describe iOS as focusing only on "…

I really think the Android back button makes all this possible (and perhaps better than on iOS devices. If a link in the iOS twitter app opens Maps, the only way to get back to where you were (pre-iOS4) was to hit home and launch the twitter app... which may have saved its state. In Android, such a workflow would just involve pressing the universal back button. I suppose in iOS4, you can now double tap home and find…

I agree, the back button is one of the best parts of the Android experience. I find myself reaching for it every time I go back to my iPod Touch.

Re: Where Are the Android Killer Apps?

#150

Post by lukeschlather »

nochiel wrote: post #144
cheald wrote: post #20

Gruber seems to make the assertion that a platform only has worth based on its exclusive "killer apps". He goes wrong there and never really recovers. Android's strength is not its suite apps, it's its flexibility. It runs on an enormous range of hardware, and doesn't require that you buy into a single vendor's toolchain to use it. The core philosophical difference between the two platforms is "Steve Jobs decides wha…

"Gruber seems to make the assertion that a platform only has worth based on its exclusive 'killer apps'. He goes wrong there and never really recovers. Android's strength is not its suite apps, it's its flexibility." It is baffling how you managed to read the article and still evade his point even though he addresses your rejoinder directly. Gruber says, "At this point, I’m guessing, Android fans are ready to exclaim…

>People don't choose Android because of its superior applications but because of its perceived flexibility/hackability. Developers don't see the Android app market as particularly profitable.

I think you've hit the crux of the flaw with Gruber's argument: developer profitability does not have much bearing on UX as those in the proprietary app developer community might like it to.

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