Linux Problems on the Desktop (2018) • Hacker News Board

Re: Linux Problems on the Desktop (2018)

#41

Post by blihp » Mon, Feb 25, 2019, 1:12 AM UTC

cheerlessbog wrote: post #13

smlacy wrote: post #9

How about a list of all the things that really work great? I've been using Linux on the desktop for nearly 20 years and I'll have to say it's fantastic, despite the occasional headache, which seems to be at a far less frequency than other major desktop operating systems.

I'm guessing you're relatively tech savvy and enjoy troubleshooting (within reason). Most people aren't, of course.

Sure, it helps to be tech savvy when installing any operating system. I'm not sure that I'd agree that most of us enjoy troubleshooting, it just goes with the territory... always has even on Windows and Mac. The tech savvy and troubleshooting tend to come into play with non-standard / niche / unsupported hardware configurations and/or running bleeding edge / complex configurations. Most desktop and laptop configurations aren't that.

The main thing a non-tech savvy user needs to worry about when considering Linux is to generally understand that hardware support lags a bit. So they should do a few web searches on the make/model of hardware they want to use + 'Linux support' before they dive in. If they don't see page after page of glowing success stories, they have their answer and should steer clear of that configuration for the time being. If they do see lots of success stories, read a few of them to see if their eyes glaze over at what is written or if it seems pretty straight-forward and they can follow what's being said. No tech savvy required.

Re: Linux Problems on the Desktop (2018)

#42

Post by UncleEntity » Mon, Feb 25, 2019, 1:13 AM UTC

> All native Linux filesystems are case sensitive about filenames which utterly confuses most users. This wonderful peculiarity doesn't have any sensible rationale. Less than 0.01% of users in the Linux world depend on this feature.

The horror...

Though I wonder why users would be confused since this only really applies to the command line and there were (multiple) other points complaining about users having to use the command line.

  user: cd Foo
  bash: cd: Foo: No such file or directory
  user: wget https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows10/win10.iso && echo "screw you linux!1!"

Re: Linux Problems on the Desktop (2018)

#43

Post by AckSyn » Mon, Feb 25, 2019, 1:15 AM UTC

Octoth0rpe wrote: post #38

> Android is not Linux I really, _really_ hate this statement. Android meets the only definition of 'linux' that matters IMO: it runs on a linux kernel. That's linux, full stop. That said, I do find myself agreeing with most of the points listed there. I just not sure I'd call them 'linux on the desktop' issues per se. They're wayland/xorg issues, deb/rpm/flatpack/snap issues, pulseaudio/alsa issues, gtk/qt issues, e…

It's not Linux. Just live with it.

Re: Linux Problems on the Desktop (2018)

#44

Post by month13 » Mon, Feb 25, 2019, 1:15 AM UTC

hartator wrote: post #21

The only thing about Linux I never really like is the package system. Like if you want to install a new software, you usually don’t get .exe or .dmg. If you are lucky, the developer or some fans took the time to package it. Then you can do ‘apt-get’ ‘yum’ or ‘pacman’. However, packages got stalled and sometimes don’t match the original author intent. You can also build from sources, but it takes time and you have to…

So strange, as i'm the polar opposite. I vastly prefer having everything update at once and be able to check versions, etc. I use homebrew and chocolately when I'm on macOS or Windows respectively to get that experience back.

I can understand trying to resolve dependencies can be a royal pain, espescially trying to find the distro's specific naming conventions, like libpq-dev vs postgresql-libs

Re: Linux Problems on the Desktop (2018)

#45

Post by PavlovsCat » Mon, Feb 25, 2019, 1:16 AM UTC

cheerlessbog wrote: post #13

smlacy wrote: post #9

How about a list of all the things that really work great? I've been using Linux on the desktop for nearly 20 years and I'll have to say it's fantastic, despite the occasional headache, which seems to be at a far less frequency than other major desktop operating systems.

I'm guessing you're relatively tech savvy and enjoy troubleshooting (within reason). Most people aren't, of course.

I assume they're not comparing their own issues with Linux vs. the issues of less tech savy people with other OS, but vs. their own experiences with other OS.

Re: Linux Problems on the Desktop (2018)

#46

Post by azinman2 » Mon, Feb 25, 2019, 1:17 AM UTC

Octoth0rpe wrote: post #38

> Android is not Linux I really, _really_ hate this statement. Android meets the only definition of 'linux' that matters IMO: it runs on a linux kernel. That's linux, full stop. That said, I do find myself agreeing with most of the points listed there. I just not sure I'd call them 'linux on the desktop' issues per se. They're wayland/xorg issues, deb/rpm/flatpack/snap issues, pulseaudio/alsa issues, gtk/qt issues, e…

Yes but when you say “state of the Linux desktop,” all of this gets bundled in. A fair number of bits also touch the kernel directly — sound, video, etc.

Re: Linux Problems on the Desktop (2018)

#47

Post by pedrocr » Mon, Feb 25, 2019, 1:17 AM UTC

hartator wrote: post #21

The only thing about Linux I never really like is the package system. Like if you want to install a new software, you usually don’t get .exe or .dmg. If you are lucky, the developer or some fans took the time to package it. Then you can do ‘apt-get’ ‘yum’ or ‘pacman’. However, packages got stalled and sometimes don’t match the original author intent. You can also build from sources, but it takes time and you have to…

I have the complete opposite experience. Everything I use is nicely packaged in Debian/Ubuntu. At most I need to add a new package source and then I get automatic updates. In Windows and OSX you used to need to manually install a bunch of packages from a bunch of locations, with very dubious security. No wonder they've both implement app stores.

Re: Linux Problems on the Desktop (2018)

#48

Post by azinman2 » Mon, Feb 25, 2019, 1:18 AM UTC

magicalhippo wrote: post #35

I've been running KDE Neon on NUC for a while, and Kubuntu before that since KDE 3.5 days. But still it's not ready to become my primary desktop. The main issue for me is RDP-like (not VNC-like) remote desktop experience. Without that I'm not even gonna try. I mean the kind where I check my desktop before I leave for work, resume the session remotely from work (when compiling or whatever), and pick up when I get home…

Apple somehow has fast VNC between its computers. Anyone know why it’s so much better?

Disclaimer: I work for Apple, but nothing related to VNC.

Re: Linux Problems on the Desktop (2018)

#49

Post by ilovecaching » Mon, Feb 25, 2019, 1:18 AM UTC

I use GNOME (Fedora 29). Works fine, except for things that NVIDIA and Cisco keep locked down (driver and codecs). Other than that, GNOME is just kind of a wacky desktop (activities and no desktop launcher are just stupid). But it does work, and I would be fine recommending it to my grandma with some extensions installed to make it more like Windows UX.

Re: Linux Problems on the Desktop (2018)

#50

Post by ilovecaching » Mon, Feb 25, 2019, 1:20 AM UTC

ilovecaching wrote: post #49

I use GNOME (Fedora 29). Works fine, except for things that NVIDIA and Cisco keep locked down (driver and codecs). Other than that, GNOME is just kind of a wacky desktop (activities and no desktop launcher are just stupid). But it does work, and I would be fine recommending it to my grandma with some extensions installed to make it more like Windows UX.

I should also mention that Linux has improved, macOS has seriously regressed. All the time bugs, and if you want to plug in you Mac into anything not made by Apple, good luck.