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America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

nytimes.com

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Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#441

Post by credit_guy »

QualityReboot wrote: post #64

I just don't understand this at all. If you can earn a million a year, do it for 3-5 years, never have to work again, and pursue your passions in life. I think the problem for most workers is the lifetime of toil, not the meaninglessness of the work. I'd happily dig ditches for 8-12 hours a day for 3 years if I knew I was completely financially independent with millions in the bank that. Actually, I'd rather do that…

One million a year is not that much, if you live in NYC. Various taxes sum up to about half of that: 330k Federal, 70k State, 40k City, 30k FICA [1]. Health insurance plus copays, a few more 10s of ks. Then there's real estate. Either you rent, or you buy. Rent for a family of 4 in Manhattan, next to a good public school can easily be >10k/month. If you buy, a 3bdr appartment in a similar zone is >$2.5MM, the mortgage plus taxes and common charges are easily >15k/month. Let's say you manage to put aside 200k/year and you want to retire after 3 years of work. If you are about 30y old, your life expectancy is about 52y [2]. That will buy you an annuity of about $22k/year [3] (assuming a 3% annual growth rate). That is far, far from "never have to work again, and pursue your passions in life".

[1] https://smartasset.com/taxes/new-york-tax-calculator#aYosnz0...

[2] https://www.ssa.gov/cgi-bin/longevity.cgi

[3]https://www.bankrate.com/calculators/investing/annuity-calcu...

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#442

Post by Spooky23 »

mikeash wrote: post #379
Spooky23 wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's more than that. People need purpose. That's why things like UBI are a pipe-dream. Any Fortune-500 executive could live a life of leisure with 2-3 years of planning. They tend to not make that choice.

Seems like that shows why UBI could work. The worry with UBI is that a ton of people just check out of the workforce forever once it’s no longer necessary in order to eat. If in fact most people want to work because they need purpose in their lives, that seems to indicate that this won’t happen.

When they did stuff like this during the great society era, it flopped.

People need support to thrive. Throwing a few bucks at people doesn’t nurture them by itself.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#443

Post by tamica »

What matters more than income is wealth. When you become a high earner especially in cities like NYC and SF, you learn about the power of inter-generational wealth and the opportunities it affords. You see it every day. You become acutely aware about how unfair the world is, and how it will only become increasingly unfair as the truly wealthy entrench their power. Forget about lifestyle creep, if you are self aware parent who wants an easy life for their kids, you start having wealth creep. You don't just want to hit a number where you can retire in a low cost area. You want enough wealth to buy your kids access. Access you didn't have when you were clawing yourself up to a high income and would have made things alot easier. Access that eliminates the need for luck.

Inter-generational wealth could require you to leave behind 10M+ for 2-3 kids. A property each.

For those of you who scoff and say that is ridiculous, you probably don't share the paradigm that the world is unfair and becoming increasingly unfair to overly benefit the wealthy. Or you are fine with letting your kids fight for themselves in this world. I wish I didn't have the above paradigm, but I have seen TOO much and that is the worldview I have.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#444

Post by cat199 »

madengr wrote: post #95
cat199 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it? Many people could retire after one year at 500k or 1M because their cost of living is such that they would be able to save almost all of it, and this would spread across their retirement..

Even a poverty level wage (for family of 4) is $25k/year. So $500k over a 20 year retirement sounds like a lot, but it’s not.

not saying it's easy, and no, doesn't sound like a lot.

but it's possible, is my point - the difference on whether it is possible or not possible is the lifestyle one chooses to lead with it.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#445

Post by gizmo686 »

itronitron wrote: post #317
axaxs wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Almost in the -exact- same boat, as if I could have written this comment myself. My favorite job, by far, was landscaping. Being outside all day, getting sun and exercise, and seeing your completed project were all very rewarding/valuable. I was in great shape, left work at work, and had no problem sleeping at night. It just doesn't pay well. I find working at computers all day rather depressing, at times pointless,…

>> I really wish there was some kind of middle ground. I think there is a market for a large, physically demanding computer keyboard. The keyboard 'keys' would require pressure from a full hand to activate, and the return and backspace keys could have a different type of lever action (pull to the side maybe). The operator would have to stand, which seems like a trend these days, and the PRO-version could come with a…

Repetative strain injury is already a common hazard of typing heavy proffesions. I'm not sure adding keyboard resistance is a good health move

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#446

Post by everdrive »

credit_guy wrote: post #441
QualityReboot wrote: post #64

I just don't understand this at all. If you can earn a million a year, do it for 3-5 years, never have to work again, and pursue your passions in life. I think the problem for most workers is the lifetime of toil, not the meaninglessness of the work. I'd happily dig ditches for 8-12 hours a day for 3 years if I knew I was completely financially independent with millions in the bank that. Actually, I'd rather do that…

One million a year is not that much, if you live in NYC. Various taxes sum up to about half of that: 330k Federal, 70k State, 40k City, 30k FICA [1]. Health insurance plus copays, a few more 10s of ks. Then there's real estate. Either you rent, or you buy. Rent for a family of 4 in Manhattan, next to a good public school can easily be >10k/month. If you buy, a 3bdr appartment in a similar zone is >$2.5MM, the mortgag…

It's very important not to live in NYC.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#447

Post by misingnoglic »

ryandrake wrote: post #425
QualityReboot wrote: post #412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's fascinating. I had no idea about the 'classes' thing. I wonder if there's an alternate track for someone already established in another field. Could an established software developer somehow transition to getting a "big bucks" management position? Or does it all flow through that class system, and if you didn't enter at the bottom, you're not able to get to the top?

As OP said, the typical way to go into management consulting or investment banking or another of these "big bucks" careers is to do it right from the start. Going to a "prestigious" undergrad school helps immensely. Being able to look and talk like a big shot helps. Slog it out in a bank as an analyst for some years. Then at some point go to MBA school as a finishing degree, and then back into a bank/consulting compa…

My "conspiracy" theory is that tech companies would be like this too, except it would literally be impossible to fully staff your CS team on elite bigshots.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#448

Post by misingnoglic »

madrox wrote: post #131
QualityReboot wrote: post #64

I just don't understand this at all. If you can earn a million a year, do it for 3-5 years, never have to work again, and pursue your passions in life. I think the problem for most workers is the lifetime of toil, not the meaninglessness of the work. I'd happily dig ditches for 8-12 hours a day for 3 years if I knew I was completely financially independent with millions in the bank that. Actually, I'd rather do that…

I’ve thought about this...especially among the very wealthy. Why continue to be a high pressure CEO when you basically never have to work again? My hypothesis is that most very high paying roles are incentive-based, and incentives can be addicting: meet a goal, get a million dollar dopamine hit. I don’t think these people hate their jobs as much as they might say they do.

I read somewhere (I don't remember where) that when you're a CEO and all your friends are CEOs, you start to compare yourself to them and want to make as much as they do.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#449

Post by misingnoglic »

ALittleLight wrote: post #330
momentmaker wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I read somewhere about to really torture a prisoner in the Galog you instruct the prisoner to just keep digging a hole and then have him fill it back up again. Continue this to break thoroughly break him down. This is done without giving him any particular reason why he is doing it for...

I don't know about "really torture". I'd have to dig and fill a ditch for a very long time before I'd prefer some traditional, physical pain based, tortures.

And I'd theoretically prefer water dropped on my head, but in practice it's just as grueling.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#450

Post by zaccus »

CompelTechnic wrote: post #416
zaccus wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

85% in equities during retirement is a bad idea.

The longer the duration, the more it is a good idea to be heavy in equities. This can be teased out of the data on firecalc.

If you're buying equities and leaving them alone for decades, sure. But if you're retired and depending on your investments for an income, being 85% in equities is insane. One prolonged bear market could wipe you out.
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