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America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

nytimes.com

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Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#231

Post by BucketSort »

mactrey wrote: post #209
BucketSort wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people don't have passions in life, they do have a passion for possession and social status though. Our culture also looks down on the people that don't have all these status symbols, and people naturally do not want to be looked down upon, so they keep racing to keep up just so their peers respect them. Our culture breeds depression. There are farmers in third world countries that live a more meaningful and joy…

That is true but also people come to care about what they do. They may not be "passionate" about work but it is what they spend the most time doing, it is their main source of daily challenge and problem solving, it represents social interaction, and it is their main source of pride and accomplishment and personal striving. To just up and leave work leaves a huge void in their lives. People can learn to fill that voi…

I said that because the parent comment said "I just don't understand this at all. If you can earn a million a year, do it for 3-5 years, never have to work again, and pursue your passions in life." They don't have those passions in life per say and fill that void with work and other things. You are actually echoing what I'm saying in your own way.

Also, I like how people bring up gardening sometimes when passion is discussed. To me, passion is coupled with expression and allows you to take on an identity in some other "world". You can be passionate about music, you can have your musical identity. You can be passionate about mathematics, you can have your way of reasoning about problems. But gardening? Is there a difference between things you really like to do and a passion?

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#232

Post by kirkules »

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #184
mrfredward wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The median income for NYC is $57,000. Surely 10X what a typical person makes is enough for a family to get by, it's just not enough for the lifestyle they want. Source: https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/newyorkcitynewy...

Avoiding lifestyle inflation in the first place is definitely part of the puzzle, but it’s not clear that it can dig you out of the hole once you’re in it. Is giving up the lifestyle they want and have really going to make them happier?

Is an answer of "yes" inconceivable?

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#233

Post by scarmig »

MrMember wrote: post #160
eclipxe wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

5 years at a million a year, after taxes in a High COL state will be about 2.5M. A healthy sum indeed, but not enough to retire on, especially with a family.

A single person could absolutely retire on 2.5M. That's $100k a year using the 4% rule.

I thought nowadays the recommendation was the 3% rule.

Still absolutely doable.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#234

Post by gshulegaard »

glitchc wrote: post #224
dclusin wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The median annual earnings of palo altans is about $400k/year. That's probably workable for cheaper areas like south palo alto where a house built in the 80s will run you $2.5 mil. Move closer to downtown and you could easily double or triple your necessary annual take.

Stock options are not counted as income. They are exactly that: Stock options. Your income is your take-home pay, specifically gross pay on your stub extrapolated to annual salary. Yes, there is capital income from stocks and other market investments, but appreciation for those comes under capital gains, which are calculated (and taxed) separately, and don’t count as employment income, for good reason: You can’t use…

Which makes it ironic that capital gains taxes can bite exercisers before they are actually able to be liquidated.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#235

Post by cryptica »

>> If you spend 12 hours a day doing work you hate, at some point it doesn’t matter what your paycheck says

Bullshit. If someone earns $1.2 million per year, they can retire after 2 or 3 years. They have no right to complain. They're weak.

$1.2 million is the definition of eternal happiness. If you earn that, whatever emotion you feel in your life is called happiness. This emotion which their greedy brains interpret as sadness, my brain would interpret as euphoria.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#236

Post by zhobbs »

vasilipupkin wrote: post #183
zhobbs wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"According to Census data, the median household income in Palo Alto is $137,000 a year, while the US average is $57,600" from: https://www.cnet.com/news/silicon-valley-middle-class-earns-...

I think this type of Census data understates household incomes. I am not exactly sure why, but Atherton comes in at about 400k a year per household. That is a lot, but doesn't seem like a lot for Atherton.

I can't find the $400k/year number anywhere. The census puts it at "$250,001" which seems like a fishy number.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#238

Post by leroy_masochist »

mrfredward wrote: post #165
eclipxe wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>what world are these people living in that you can't give up a job that you hate because you can't afford to live on 500-600k. New York City

The median income for NYC is $57,000. Surely 10X what a typical person makes is enough for a family to get by, it's just not enough for the lifestyle they want. Source: https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/newyorkcitynewy...

You are correct, but if this guy's an HBS alum pulling in 7 figures on the buy side, then he and his family are living the Upper East Side lifestyle which means:

Private school tuition - $50k/kid/year Additional activities such as tutoring, sports, etc - $10-20k/kid/year Mortgages+fees or rent for a 1,500 square foot apartment in a doorman building in East 80's - $75,000-150,000/year Mortgage or rent for country home in Hamptons or Litchfield County - $40,000-100,000/year

Literally half of his income is going to be taxed as an NYC resident. So he's got $600k of cash flow and if he has 2 or 3 kids, the very basic fixed costs of housing and schooling are likely taking up about half of that. With the remaining half he has to pay for food, vacations, cars, clothing, etc, and anything left after that will get saved.

To be clear, nobody is making this guy do this. Nobody's forcing him to "summer" anywhere, nobody's forcing him to enroll his daughters at Spence when PS 6 is free. But at the same time, this is a guy who came up through a system in which preppy affluence was the chosen lifestyle of his "me 10 years from now" role models. As easy as it is to mock the concept of anyone being "trapped" when they make 1.2mm a year, the truth is that stopping his current job would be profoundly disruptive and stressful for this guy, his wife and their kids. So I get where his wife is coming from when she laughs at his mention of the startup.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#239

Post by libraryatnight »

Murdoch wrote: post #17

The rich are depressed, the middle-class is shrinking and fearful, the poor are hopeless. I'm gonna take a leap here and say maybe people need some religion in their lives to give direction and meaning. I found it interesting that a person in the article who made $1.2M a year was still depressed in thinking they were wasting their lives and it was all meaningless. I ask myself, does this person have children? a famil…

The happiest people I know aren't religious, but they have strong personal philosophies born out of healthy relationships and education. We don't need religion, we just need a healthier culture.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#240

Post by throwaway-1283 »

cryptica wrote: post #235

>> If you spend 12 hours a day doing work you hate, at some point it doesn’t matter what your paycheck says Bullshit. If someone earns $1.2 million per year, they can retire after 2 or 3 years. They have no right to complain. They're weak. $1.2 million is the definition of eternal happiness. If you earn that, whatever emotion you feel in your life is called happiness. This emotion which their greedy brains interpret…

You're assuming not working/retirement = happiness, which is wrong.
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