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America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

nytimes.com

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Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#181

Post by harperlee »

kartan wrote: post #176
Murdoch wrote: post #17

The rich are depressed, the middle-class is shrinking and fearful, the poor are hopeless. I'm gonna take a leap here and say maybe people need some religion in their lives to give direction and meaning. I found it interesting that a person in the article who made $1.2M a year was still depressed in thinking they were wasting their lives and it was all meaningless. I ask myself, does this person have children? a famil…

> Religion instills this virtue and gives framework of how our actions on earth and our ability to reason and create is an imitation of "god" aka creation of existence. Isn't USA more religious than other more happy countries? Is not possible that actually religion and other external expectations are making Americans miserable? If any, there is a correlation between religious countries and unhappiness. Can you elabor…

Really? I read long time ago, not at the country level, but that religious individuals were more happy.

Edit: https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/religion-happy-athe...

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#182

Post by kartan »

jgust wrote: post #133
Murdoch wrote: post #17

The rich are depressed, the middle-class is shrinking and fearful, the poor are hopeless. I'm gonna take a leap here and say maybe people need some religion in their lives to give direction and meaning. I found it interesting that a person in the article who made $1.2M a year was still depressed in thinking they were wasting their lives and it was all meaningless. I ask myself, does this person have children? a famil…

I agree with your point, but not necessarily the execution. We deserve a better religion, one that skips the hand-wavey-guy-in-the-sky implausibility but can still serve as a mental shortcut for whatever society agrees morality is ~currently~.

> but can still serve as a mental shortcut for whatever society agrees morality is ~currently~.

Can that be philosophy and humanist approaches? That is a way to look for higher meaning without rewarding fanaticism or dogma.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#183

Post by vasilipupkin »

zhobbs wrote: post #163
dclusin wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The median annual earnings of palo altans is about $400k/year. That's probably workable for cheaper areas like south palo alto where a house built in the 80s will run you $2.5 mil. Move closer to downtown and you could easily double or triple your necessary annual take.

"According to Census data, the median household income in Palo Alto is $137,000 a year, while the US average is $57,600" from: https://www.cnet.com/news/silicon-valley-middle-class-earns-...

I think this type of Census data understates household incomes. I am not exactly sure why, but Atherton comes in at about 400k a year per household. That is a lot, but doesn't seem like a lot for Atherton.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#184

Post by SpicyLemonZest »

mrfredward wrote: post #165
eclipxe wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>what world are these people living in that you can't give up a job that you hate because you can't afford to live on 500-600k. New York City

The median income for NYC is $57,000. Surely 10X what a typical person makes is enough for a family to get by, it's just not enough for the lifestyle they want. Source: https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/newyorkcitynewy...

Avoiding lifestyle inflation in the first place is definitely part of the puzzle, but it’s not clear that it can dig you out of the hole once you’re in it. Is giving up the lifestyle they want and have really going to make them happier?

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#185

Post by munk-a »

germinalphrase wrote: post #180
nostromo wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Practicing regularly to increase self-knowledge, thinking spiritually, reflecting on your relation to the world – do you not consider that a religion? I'd call that mindfulness not religion.

Religion has been the guiding force for this kind of internal reflection and family/community thought. As religion has declined in many west societies, we haven’t replaced them effectively. We may not need more religion, but it sure seems like we need something . Building our society so heavily on economic expediency can’t be healthy long term.

I'm in favor of more prolific philosophy circles. There is probably a group in your area that gets together regularly to discuss the works of different philosophers, join in and study up on some Kierkegaard and I think you'll find it gives you a lot of the same pay off.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#186

Post by thorwasdfasdf »

I don't have much sympathy for someone who earns 1.2 million a year. No matter how bad it is, all you have to do is get your spending down to an absolute minimum and save up for 2 years, then you'll have over 1 million in the bank. Then move out to a nice midwestern town and live happily ever after.

I know it's really rough leaving all your friends and family and everything you know, but it's not as rough as being poor/homeless your entire life.

The meaning of life is to live (not work). The meaning of work is to make money. Money lets you live.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#187

Post by dqpb »

Murdoch wrote: post #17

The rich are depressed, the middle-class is shrinking and fearful, the poor are hopeless. I'm gonna take a leap here and say maybe people need some religion in their lives to give direction and meaning. I found it interesting that a person in the article who made $1.2M a year was still depressed in thinking they were wasting their lives and it was all meaningless. I ask myself, does this person have children? a famil…

Living in a cosmological fantasy doesn't give your life meaning.

Mass delusion isn't direction.

Religion uses the facade of "values" to cover up it's core insanity, and sweep it's centuries of war mongering under the rug.

I agree that raising a family makes your life more fulfilling and meaningful. After all, reproduction is arguably the "meaning" of life.

But, raising children in a religion that warps their concept of reality is child abuse.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#189

Post by caconym_ »

Murdoch wrote: post #17

The rich are depressed, the middle-class is shrinking and fearful, the poor are hopeless. I'm gonna take a leap here and say maybe people need some religion in their lives to give direction and meaning. I found it interesting that a person in the article who made $1.2M a year was still depressed in thinking they were wasting their lives and it was all meaningless. I ask myself, does this person have children? a famil…

I think it is a leap to say that duty and/or religion are the only logical cures for the existential ills of a miserable person stuck on a meaningless treadmill.

I started writing fiction in my own time and it has done wonders for my mental health and existential outlook. I do it for myself alone, and I'm not sorry for that; I certainly won't be made to feel guilty about it.

I'm sure what I'm doing is just one of many roads people could take out of their existential doldrums. Religion is one of those roads, I have no doubt.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#190

Post by antisthenes »

toasterlovin wrote: post #70
strikelaserclaw wrote: post #6

- He had received an offer at a start-up, and he would have loved to take it, but it paid half as much, and he felt locked into a lifestyle that made this pay cut impossible. “My wife laughed when I told her about it,” he said. Sounds like a good wife to me, and this "pay cut" is making 500k-600k instead of 1.2 million, what world are these people living in that you can't give up a job that you hate because you can't…

So this dovetails with what I think is the most fascinating topic in evolution: the demographic transition in humans. If you're not familiar, demographic transition is the term used to describe what has happened to the demography of nations as they become developed. Which is that, rather than producing more children with their material abundance, people in rich nations have less children. This is not, at all, what bi…

> people in rich nations have less children. This is not, at all, what biology would predict. More resources should lead to more offspring.

This is not correct. Rich people in rich nations have more kids than middle-income people in rich nations. What matters is your comparative purchasing power.

Fertility actually increases with income, even for women with education; this is mostly due to rich being able to afford the costs of child care, and feeling secure enough to invest into all of their children as much as they feel they need to. (whereas a middle-class, educated woman would only feel secure investing into 1 child)

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