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How Former Ref Tim Donaghy Conspired to Fix NBA Games

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Re: How Former Ref Tim Donaghy Conspired to Fix NBA Games

#81

If the calls are so subjective that one can't tell the difference between a ref accidentally being way off and on purpose being way off, then maybe your sport/rules are the problem when being way off is either excusable or indeterminable. (in the NBA and some other sports, you can basically call a foul every play)

This is why I mostly stopped watching the NBA and basketball in general. The foul-calling situation is ridiculous. Many offensive fouls get called as defensive fouls and even good calls slow down the game significantly, more than it's already slowed by the million timeouts in the game. A simple solution would be to lower the amount of fouls a player is allowed to commit before they are sent off like the card system in soccer. Or put players in a penalty box like in hockey for a few mins after every foul and make the team play one down. Or just simply call offensive fouls when the offensive player obviously just runs into the defensive player instead of the other way around. There are many possibilities, but I don't see the NBA exploring any of them and they are no stranger to rule changes. Maybe the NBA wants the games fixed, who knows? Regardless, they have the power to fix this and do not. Hard to argue they are acting in good conscience.

Re: How Former Ref Tim Donaghy Conspired to Fix NBA Games

#82

If the calls are so subjective that one can't tell the difference between a ref accidentally being way off and on purpose being way off, then maybe your sport/rules are the problem when being way off is either excusable or indeterminable. (in the NBA and some other sports, you can basically call a foul every play)

Back in 2002 I worked in IT for a California sports management firm. They had several NBA players as clients as well as NFL and MLB. One of the guys that worked there told me that the NBA was fixed. Everything included the lottery. Their goal was to get the high market teams to be in the Finals for TV ratings. Refs that were calling games to make this happen. Not sure if this was his opinion or fact, but it seems lik…

  Everything included the lottery.
The 1993 lottery seemed pretty blatant. Dallas #1, Golden State#2, ... Oops! Machine jammed on #6(?). Result? Do the entire thing over from the start in a back room with no cameras. Surprise! Magic get #1 the second year in a row despite having the lowest chance and Dallas drops to #4.

Re: How Former Ref Tim Donaghy Conspired to Fix NBA Games

#83
post #79
post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Donaghy's track record of making calls that favored his bet was 23-3-4 They know which games he bet on and which games he officiated, so they can track his calls in games where he had a vested interest in affecting the outcome. > The odds that Tim Donaghy would have randomly made calls that produced that imbalance are 6,155-to-1. Basically, there's no way an unbiased ref could generate such an accurate prediction o…

Those odds aren’t really that bad. Many poker hands have worse odds but no one is particularly amazed when they get them. That being said, it does seem a little sketchy.

how many millions of poker hands have been played though?

now how many thousands of basketball games?

Re: How Former Ref Tim Donaghy Conspired to Fix NBA Games

#84
2006 Western Conf semi finals with Suns/Spurs was pretty much the last straw for me and last time for me actually taking the game serious. Wasnt at all surprised to find out later that Donaghy made money off such a shitty performance. Such a shame as Nash never won a title and this year was arguably had his best chance. The sort of reckless officisting caused a ton of damage both physicaly and mentally to the Suns (as it encourages benifiting teams to be dangerously aggressive and can mentally breaks down the opposing teams, leading to technicalities)

This Youtube vid has a bit of the horror: https://youtu.be/fvkKdXLwt0U

Re: How Former Ref Tim Donaghy Conspired to Fix NBA Games

#85
post #20
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s so much money in sports betting now, there’s no way that there isn’t a ton of corrupt behavior going on. Allowing widespread legit betting is asking for less than honest behavior. Even a single player throwing a few shots or missing/hitting a metric can make people money. The leagues can also not notice things that encourage behavior that fans like. Baseball players on steroids attracted a lot of buzz in the…

It's true there's a lot of money in sports betting, but there is even more money in the NBA (TV deals, player salaries, team valuations, etc). That larger sum of money would be existentially threatened by continued corruption within the league due to sports betting. Thus, one would think that more money would go towards stopping any corruption. I suppose that doesn't mean there wouldn't be any corruption, but it seem…

People aren’t rational, and many people are hooked on gambling.

Look at Pete Rose as an example.

Re: How Former Ref Tim Donaghy Conspired to Fix NBA Games

#86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Game 3 of the NBA Finals in 2008 was pretty darn obvious. Anyone who watched that game had to have known that the game was fixed. http://www.espn.com/nba/news/story?id=3436401 “The Lakers attempted 40 free throws to the Kings' 25 in that game, and Los Angeles made 21 of 27 from the line while Sacramento converted 7 of 9 in the fourth quarter alone. In addition, a foul was called against Mike Bibby of the Kings after…

You misread the article. It was 2002 and wasn't the NBA Finals.

Yeah, I didn’t read very carefully. I was just looking for any article on the game. I didn’t recall it being in the NBA Finals, but I let the wording of the article confuse me.

Re: How Former Ref Tim Donaghy Conspired to Fix NBA Games

#87
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Game 3 of the NBA Finals in 2008 was pretty darn obvious. Anyone who watched that game had to have known that the game was fixed. http://www.espn.com/nba/news/story?id=3436401 “The Lakers attempted 40 free throws to the Kings' 25 in that game, and Los Angeles made 21 of 27 from the line while Sacramento converted 7 of 9 in the fourth quarter alone. In addition, a foul was called against Mike Bibby of the Kings after…

I would like to see a more objective scoring. Lopsided foul ratios are not solid evidence of bias by themselves. Teams play different styles and sometimes have bad defensive nights. Nor is a single bad call evidence of bias, such as the nosebleed incident. An example of a good evaluation would be several professional referees, not employed by the NBA, observe the videos of that game from different angles, and score t…

You can be the judge. Here is the video. This wasn’t a close call. It was an egregiously wrong call. There was no way that ten out of ten impartial referees wouldn’t call this a foul on Kobe.

https://youtu.be/mbWgWZjo1nI

Re: How Former Ref Tim Donaghy Conspired to Fix NBA Games

#88
post #43
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn't a ref throwing games for kickbacks, but it's surprising that nowhere in this thread has anyone mentioned the most blatant game-fixing in league history, which was the 1984 Lakers-Celtics finals. In this series, the league thought their predominantly-White fanbase needed to see Larry Bird (who is White) win the series. (Spoiler alert: Celtics won in 7). Some of the highlights (lowlights?) of Magic Johnson b…

Former competitive basketball player here, still play pickup regularly. "Nobody who has ever played even semicompetitive organized basketball could mistake this for an honest performance" is blatant hyperbole. I could not possibly disagree with you more re: 1984 Lakers/Celtics, and I'm a huge Lakers fan who'd love to believe they were really the better team. I'm not going to bother to click on the video, but I'm sure…

You are trying to prove that a league isn't crooked by pointing out all the similar "mistakes" that make the league look crooked. I'm not saying that they are crooked. I'm just wondering if you have thought this argument through.

Re: How Former Ref Tim Donaghy Conspired to Fix NBA Games

#89

This is a messed up story, but the idea that the NBA is rigged is patently ridiculous. The refs are humans and are biased to crowd noise, and you can bet it harder to stand up to LeBron James screaming at you than Quinn Cook. What evidence is there that they "actively encourage seeing it the home teams way?" What if a huge star is on the road, what's the call there? Of course they want the bigger media markets to do…

He wasn't turning donkeys into race horses. He was tampering with the spread. Just calling or not calling traveling, say 3 or 4 times and calling or not calling charging a couple times and you're easily looking at nearly a 10point swing. Lebron doesn't have to lose, just not win by 15 points...

Donaghy told his handler (allegedly) that he could swing a game by 6 points, anything more and it would be too obvious.

Re: How Former Ref Tim Donaghy Conspired to Fix NBA Games

#90
I remember the year Donaghy was caught. That was a bizarre playoffs where every single series seemed to be going 7 games, with home teams basically never losing. Then Donaghy story explodes right before the playoffs, and suddenly the finals were over in 5 or 6 games and the entire appearance of the games changed.

On top of the suspicious "stolen" playoff series with Sacramento and Miami and Phoenix in previous years.

I am convinced Donaghy was just side betting manipulation orders that were coming down from David Stern. Once caught, the league had to stop manipulating the refereeing and Donaghy became the scapegoat.

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