I had no idea the copyright lobbying was so strong in Germany. We absolutely suck.
Netherlands, Finland, Luxembourg, Poland and Italy Oppose EU Copyright Directive
101–110 of 164 posts
Re: Netherlands, Finland, Luxembourg, Poland and Italy Oppose EU Copyright Directive
#102Earlier quoted context omitted.
Of the listed countries, 6 of the 8 - Netherlands, Finland, Luxembourg, Sweden, Estonia and Denmark - are all 1 constituency countries, so the MEPs represent the entire country MEPs may well decide different things to the government though, just as the U.S. House could have a different view to the Senate.
Proportional representation. The MEPs don't represent the entire country, they represent the specific people who voted for them. The fundamental principle of who people represent under PR is very different from FPTP. Under FTPT, the people living in a certain area vote for a "winner", who then represents the entire area. If 51% of the people vote for candidate A, and 49% vote for candidate B, then the wishes of 49% o…
"Under FTPT, the people..."
You probably meant 'FPTP' there ('First Past The Post')? If not, what does this stand for?
Re: Netherlands, Finland, Luxembourg, Poland and Italy Oppose EU Copyright Directive
#103Earlier quoted context omitted.
So I vote for a party in the EU as a whole, and if enough people in my country or other countries do too, some candidate from some country gets elected?
No. For the EU parliament you vote for a representative (from your country, that usually belongs to some political party).
That is true, but in the EU parliament as in many other systems there is an incentive for representatives to vote in favor of the (EU) party they are in - as huge majority of representatives have on this case despite of their own governments showing displease to this particular ruling.
I will not personally be voting for any of the representatives that voted for this particular ruling as none of them they gave no satisfactory explanation why they actually voted this way anything other than that their EU party wanted it to pass. My country being Finland, and we definitely have been opposed to this from the start.
Re: Netherlands, Finland, Luxembourg, Poland and Italy Oppose EU Copyright Directive
#104Earlier quoted context omitted.
Actually, the analogy does apply in the general to way the EU works, and your explanation is the exact opposite of how it usually works. The general rule of thumb is "as long as you meet the EU criteria, your product/service/etc is legal in all EU states" , removing the need for figuring out red tape for each individual country. So if you have, say, a perfume that you want to sell, then as long as you follow the EU r…
And if you accidentally break a law because some countries did more than the directive?
IIRC you may make higher demands on your own country, but cannot restrict goods from foreign markets that meet the EU criteria (that's the entire point after all). It can get a bit weird.
For example, IIRC Dutch laws regarding for cheese production safety are more strict than what EU laws require, with mandatory weekly testing for bacterial growth. However, any cheese meeting EU laws is allowed to be sold on the market.
Re: Netherlands, Finland, Luxembourg, Poland and Italy Oppose EU Copyright Directive
#105Earlier quoted context omitted.
As a Swede this is exactly why I'm against the EU. Free trade is great, I get that, but I really don't like the centralization and getting less and less influence. I don't want Germany and France to shove idiotic internet laws down my throat. In some way it's also why I'm rooting for U.K. to leave the EU and for it to work out.
Just wondering, what exactly makes you think the laws shoved to your throat by Sweden would on average be any less idiotic? And why would just Sweden be the right size of entity that optimizes the idiocy of the laws, why independent Skåne would not be shoving less idiotic laws to your throat?
Because when Swedish politicians push for stupid laws they can be revoked while campaigning for it. The politicians will care, because the politicians are the ones who risk not getting elected if they ignore the issue. If the EU decides on a directive that people don't like, then the only way to get it revoked would be for Swedish people to start campaigning foreign politicians, who they cannot vote for.
Re: Netherlands, Finland, Luxembourg, Poland and Italy Oppose EU Copyright Directive
#106Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm under the illusion it's easier to influence a Swedish politician than it is to influence an order of magnitude more foreign politicians, to get the same proportion of influence. The problem will always be there of course. I'm not saying Sweden is the optimal size, I just find it better than the EU alternative. If you go to the extreme you can get too small as well. For example a society with a couple of thousand…
> I'm under the illusion I think that's brexit all over, illusion rather than substance. > it's easier to influence a Swedish politician than it is to influence an order of magnitude more foreign politicians, to get the same proportion of influence. Yes, and that's bad. A big benefit of the EU is it's harder to manipulate -- there's a lot more people to control -- at least 16 independent heads of governments and near…
>Yes, and that's bad.
How is that bad? It's possible to change the law afterwards. With the EU it's basically impossible. Swedes would have to lobby politicians from a foreign country that they can't vote for nor can they speak the same language. That's terrible.
>Copyright is clearly is one of those things that needs to be tackled at a level of government higher than the local town council, especially if you have an open market. Imagine a world where a movie made in LA wasn't protected by copyright in New York, let alone Toronto, Paris, or Singapore.
But it has been protected on a higher level since the 19th century. Almost every country in the world is a signatory to the Berne convention.
Re: Netherlands, Finland, Luxembourg, Poland and Italy Oppose EU Copyright Directive
#107The issue I see with the EU, is that it's essentially centralizing all the "countries" into "states". Where by, each of the states will simply answer to the two countries with the most power. Namely Germany, followed by France. Personally, I think it's sad. It's as if we're watching the destruction of all the national identities. Only to be centralized by powers who are only interested in their own national identity.…
You win at right wing talking-points bingo. The whole point of the EU is that Europe is better when it's together. There were multiple wars, involving the death of many millions, and that's just the last hundred years. Independence is just dressed up nationalism, and all the ugly facets it is made of.
>Independence is just dressed up nationalism, and all the ugly facets it is made of.
I'm not sure if this is your intention, but this one line screams authoritarianism to me.
Re: Netherlands, Finland, Luxembourg, Poland and Italy Oppose EU Copyright Directive
#108The issue I see with the EU, is that it's essentially centralizing all the "countries" into "states". Where by, each of the states will simply answer to the two countries with the most power. Namely Germany, followed by France. Personally, I think it's sad. It's as if we're watching the destruction of all the national identities. Only to be centralized by powers who are only interested in their own national identity.…
I don't know what you mean by "centralized economy" but centralized markets have their (huge) benefits. Think about how much easier it is to launch a service within all the United States of America at once compared to launching it in all of the countries in the European Union. The language barrier is a huge obstacle, no doubt, but it's far from the only one. Another way to look at "centralization" is from the point o…
Well, I'm looking at it, and considering how the EU basically has almost no major tech companies, I would say that the EU is not really serving its purpose. Even right now different parts of the EU are region locked into different services. Eg sometimes the Baltic states are clumped in with CIS. Add on the many additional regulations and the EU seems to be a worse place to launch a service than in most developed places in the world.
Re: Netherlands, Finland, Luxembourg, Poland and Italy Oppose EU Copyright Directive
#109Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm under the illusion it's easier to influence a Swedish politician than it is to influence an order of magnitude more foreign politicians, to get the same proportion of influence. The problem will always be there of course. I'm not saying Sweden is the optimal size, I just find it better than the EU alternative. If you go to the extreme you can get too small as well. For example a society with a couple of thousand…
That's interesting, I've found it much easier to get in touch with MEP representatives than it is to get in touch with national politicians, and MEPs have been much more responsive as well. Have you tried contacting any MPs, and/or MEPs, and what was your experience?
Okay, but let's say you convince all the MEPs in your small country. Now what? Are you going to start sending letters to MEPs from foreign countries? Why would they care about what you have to say?
Re: Netherlands, Finland, Luxembourg, Poland and Italy Oppose EU Copyright Directive
#110Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I'm under the illusion I think that's brexit all over, illusion rather than substance. > it's easier to influence a Swedish politician than it is to influence an order of magnitude more foreign politicians, to get the same proportion of influence. Yes, and that's bad. A big benefit of the EU is it's harder to manipulate -- there's a lot more people to control -- at least 16 independent heads of governments and near…
> Yes, and that's bad. How is that bad? It's possible to change the law afterwards. With the EU it's basically impossible. Swedes would have to lobby politicians from a foreign country that they can't vote for nor can they speak the same language. That's terrible. > Copyright is clearly is one of those things that needs to be tackled at a level of government higher than the local town council, especially if you have…
To drive home just how bad this is in the EU, a few days ago the European Commission posted this astounding blog post on Article 13: http://archive.is/snRgE
They pretend that they're helping ordinary citizens fight back against the big internet platforms by creating this law that only big platforms stand a chance of complying with. That they're helping tip the balance in favour of creators by forcing platforms to kill their livelihoods through false positives and outright extortion attempts. That anyone who sees this as it actually is has been brainwashed by the evil, foreign Californian big tech.
They're also the only institution with the power to propose new EU laws - and there's essentially nothing we, as ordinary citizens, can do to replace the current members with people who might actually care about our interests. They're appointed through a process so indirect that any vestige of democracy is practically homeopathic, and they're not even meant to represent us in the first place.